[silverado]

My car came with swirl marks in the hood that I only saw in bright sunlight. It is a big bummer, but it's been a while now and I decided not to dwell on the negative, to try to get this taken care of and to continue enjoying the fabulous car. I'm in the precess of arranging for the hood to be repainted by the dealer (although I'm not sure I should do this to a new car).

I cannot wash the car myself where I live but I've only had it hand-washed at a detailing place and it got washed a few times at the dealer. I do clean up bird droppings and insects myself using the finest terry cloth or micro fiber rags.

With all this care (the maximum I could give the car), I'm starting to see more swirl marks in different places on the car as well as tiny superficial scratches where some less than prestine rags have been used The car still looks awesome to any casual observer, but to me, I see all these imperfections in my baby.

I thought I would be able to prevent swirl marks and tiny superficial scratches by sticking to hand washes at good places and being careful by removing bird droppings and insects as fast as possible, but it seems that this is not going ot happen.

So I would like hear from more experienced fine black car owners who care about their cars.

Is this the best I could expect? Should my remedy be regular waxing and/or employing things like the zaino process? Would doing that cover up these imperfections? Should that be my plan going forward?

Thank you in advance for any information or advice.

[chrisbin]

Just and then

[Broken1]

Easy for you to say with a silver car!!

I've had my car for about 3 weeks now. There's little you can do with the swirl mark scratch thing.

I find that polishing the car helps a bit, but they just come back!

Best bet, don't park in bright sunlight and you don't see them! This is one of the downsides to a black car unfortunately!

[chrisbin]

Yeah but I've got a black Touareg too.......

But as you say, not a lot you can do about it, just use the vehicle as intended and

[silverado]

Originally Posted by chrisbin

Yeah but I've got a black Touareg too.......

But as you say, not a lot you can do about it, just use the vehicle as intended and

Who said anything about not enjoying it? It is a seperate issue. My question is about appearance... how can we make it look its best?

[Petercat]

I share your pain.

Black cars are tough to live with. I love the look, but the minor imperfections make me nuts. I too have decided that these are minor details of the car being black and am trying to appreciate how great the car is, even if it is dirty.

I love the Zaino process, it's my "alone time" with my car. But, I'm not going to do it every time when I wash it. You will be happy with the quality of the results. Just Zaino twice a year and know that it will only be "perfect for the short period right after. In between the bi-annual zaino treatment, just use the Z6 after you wash and it will still shine pretty.

Just remember when you wash, go in straight lines. Front to back on hood, top and trunk. Top to bottom on doors and sides. The tiny scratches will not stand out as much when they are going the same direction.

[Petercat]

Just saw your post on my pics thread. Yes, Zaino really works well. I am in no way affiliated with them and was as skeptical when I was first told to use it. But, it's the best product I've seen/used and I've been exposed to many high value cars and care products.

It is a long process and you need to be patient and keep taking the steps just as they describe. You will be amazed at the look of the car.
Get the $85 kit, it has everything. On my e90, I did the clay bar and two applications of the Z5 which takes out the swirls, but left it kind of greasy. Don't worry though, the Z2 comes in and makes it perfect, no greasy look, just like glass. You can keep applying coats of Z2 to get a deeper look, but after just one coat, I was amazed.

[chrisbin]

Originally Posted by silverado

Who said anything about not enjoying it? It is a seperate issue. My question is about appearance... how can we make it look its best?

I don't think I said anything about not enjoying it....think I was just encouraging you to enjoy it.....

I wash our cars every week by hand, without fail....so I'm with you all the way about keeping them looking good. But I guess there's only so much you can do. I always said I would never have a black car, then we got the Treg and, for me, it just had to be black. But its a pain, and shows up every little scratch/blemish.

So I got a silver E90..

[Dnz]

Black is all good. You just gotta be careful.

Never use a wool washmit, only chenille cotton.
Do it yourself - its not that hard, and you wont mess it up.
Keep it waxed - The shiny is gonna live longer
Use a good glaze - It will hide swirlies, and make the colour appear richer.

My car is over 10 years old now, never been repainted, and its still rather pristine.

Black is the nicest colour clean, looks wet and glossy and totally hawt.
Black is also pure evil when it rains - however with a good coat of wax, you can always tell that its shiny under the grime

Take your time, it will be worth the effort. Most things can be polished out etc.

http://photobucket.com/albums/v301/d...t=100_0337.jpg
motivation:
http://photobucket.com/albums/v301/dennisnz/ ignore the recent ones, dirty as hell! Detailing car tomoro, gonna have more pics up. Got new wheels now hoorah!

[chrisbin]

Originally Posted by Dnz

Black is all good. You just gotta be careful.

Never use a wool washmit, only chenille cotton.
Do it yourself - its not that hard, and you wont mess it up.
Keep it waxed - The shiny is gonna live longer
Use a good glaze - It will hide swirlies, and make the colour appear richer.

My car is over 10 years old now, never been repainted, and its still rather pristine.

Black is the nicest colour clean, looks wet and glossy and totally hawt.
Black is also pure evil when it rains - however with a good coat of wax, you can always tell that its shiny under the grime

Take your time, it will be worth the effort. Most things can be polished out etc.

http://photobucket.com/albums/v301/d...t=100_0337.jpg
motivation:
http://photobucket.com/albums/v301/dennisnz/ ignore the recent ones, dirty as hell! Detailing car tomoro, gonna have more pics up. Got new wheels now hoorah!

Nice pics!! Whereabouts in NZ are you? Used to make it out once a year and do Auckland, Wellington, Christchurch, Dunedin. Still got a good friend in Christchurch who I didn't talk rugby to recently.....

(Sorry, bit of thread drift there........................ )

[Dnz]

Im from auckland...

But yeah, black is a perfectly good colour if you got the time to care for it. I even have illusions that bmw paint is better than others, as my E36 has next to no paint flaws/scratches compared to its asian counterparts of equal age..

[Petercat]

Originally Posted by Dnz

Im from auckland...

But yeah, black is a perfectly good colour if you got the time to care for it. I even have illusions that bmw paint is better than others, as my E36 has next to no paint flaws/scratches compared to its asian counterparts of equal age..

I don't think the paint is any better... You are just the car care expert we all aspire to be. Your car is beautiful. Shows that when you care for a BMW, their design is timeless.

[prolix21]

just had my car washed at the bmw store and now my brand new black beauty is full of horrific swirl marks. so depressing. i had hopes about their hand wash service, but i guess that all went down the toilet. hopefully most of them are smears and not actual swirrels. i guess a trip through the touchless tomorrow will tell me that.

its nearly impossible for me to wash the car myself b/c i live downtown. i'm almost tempted to move so i can have a place to wash my car.

[teamgomez]

Swirl marks are an eventuality of ownership- the degree to which you have them is directly related to wash protocol/general care.

The worst thing you can do, IMO, is have anybody other than yourself wash the car with a rag. How many times have you seen a lot person drop a towel or sponge, pick it right back up, and keep working? Embedded debris causes the micro-marring and can actually penetrate the clear in worst case scenarios.

Some tricks to keep away from swirls are precisely covered above. I wouldn't paint a hood just b/c of swirls or else you'll have a hood that is more prone to chipping. A good detailer can remove any swirl as long as the clear isn't penetrated. Dealerships are the worst offenders at wiping down cars...they'll wipe off a dirty car with a wet rag in a heartbeat and this is mayhem to a paintjob.

Here's how I keep my cars swirl-free:

1. Never, ever wipe it off with a damp rag.
2. Never, ever let anybody else touch it (dealership visits get the "NO WASH" tag)
3. Only use a CLEAN sponge with a bucket that has a grit guard.
4. Never use a CA Waterblade or Car Duster.
5. Rinse the car w/ DI water so I don't have to towel dry it.

Twice a year (getting better at swirl avoidance so may go down to once/yr) I'll SMR the cars with a porter cable ROB (daily drivers: mine and the wife's) and go thru the Zaino process. After each weekly wash, I let the cars drip-dry and then I'll Z8 them in the morning. May sound a little fanatical, but really doesn't take much time at all and the cars always look like I've spent a weekend detailing them.

Granted, I live in San Diego where the last bug that hit the front end was about 4 months ago, we have no pollen to worry about, but the freeway debris is near murder (ran over 2 sliding glass doors, got hit by a trailer receiver hitch, just missed 2 Lazy Boys on sep occasions, and just had a golf ball come from nowhere and bounce 6' in front of me going 70...lovely) and Zaino can't help much there.

Hope this helps- would be happy to delineate zaino application protocol if you're interested.

~John

[bozo5521]

Z5 on top of some Z2 will clear up ANY swirl marks you have..Its a shame you dont have the facilities to do a hand wash yourself. I know how that feels..ARGGH!!

All it takes is a application of Z8 OR Z6 every now and then to keep them away...

[teamgomez]

Originally Posted by bozo5521

Z5 on top of some Z2 will clear up ANY swirl marks you have...

hmmm....this is the first I've heard of anybody finding that Zaino will remove swirl marks layering Z5 over Z2. I used to lay down Z5 first, then Z2 over it but believe the results were psychological. Given there's no fillers (oils) in Zaino, the ability to cover swirls is diminished thus requiring a more concerted effort to remove them via a SMR vice lathering on some oil-based product to fill them in (temporarily).

Would love to discover a new trick but believe that the surface must be swirl free to enjoy the maximum benefit of the optical clarity of the Zaino products. Happen to have any before/after photos of the type of swirl marks you're referring to in order to save some testing?

[F32Fleet]

Visit detailing forum on Roadfly. I have same color car, it's outside 24/7 and not one swirl mark.

[bozo5521]

Originally Posted by teamgomez

Would love to discover a new trick but believe that the surface must be swirl free to enjoy the maximum benefit of the optical clarity of the Zaino products.

You're absolutely right..I should have said MINOR swirls...Using a semi-potent water Dawn mixture will take care of it..The point of the Z5 and Z2 is that they will reinforce the pattern...translation:

:mad: DO NOT APPLY ZAINO IN CIRCLES!!! :mad:

some people will always revert to "traditional" ways, but this is a sacrilege in Zaino application!!...and applying in STRAIGHT lines WILL get rid of the marks..ESPECIALLY with multiple apps!!

[teamgomez]

Agreed- do not apply in circles (wax on wax off worked great for Karate-san, but not for sun-halo micro marred surfaces).

Wives-tale exists about back and forth along the longitudenal axis on horizontal surfaces, and vertically on the side panels to 'enhance overall depth'. Objective results pending somewhere....

Since Zaino polish has no abrasive quality and no oils, I've found the ability to diminish swirls is approx 1/10th that of a carnuba product. The stuff just bonds to what you apply it to in a very uniform manner with severe optical clarity (hence the gloss). On the number of cars I've applied it on, the only real product that diminished swirls was a little elbow grease courtesy of a ROB and SMR.

I only offer this point to clarify to the non-zaino initiated that it is not a magic elixer like a carnuba based product can be. Don't put it down on mom's merc and expect it to hide the sins of 4 years thru the car wash. Zymol/P21S will do a better job of hiding it...for about 72 hours in the hot sun until it melts off.

For a proper Zaino application, the finest resutls are achieved with an SMR evolution prior to Z2 or Z5. Even for those cars "fresh off the dealer's lot" (ref guido the lot attendant and his rag he's had stuffed in his back pocket all day that will dry-wipe your car b/f you arrive)...

[prolix21]

i wish my zaino would get here so i can clean up my car. its a big smeared mess right now. ok, its not that bad, and most people might not notice it but i notice. we need a separate support group for owners of black bmw's.

[BMRu4ia]

Originally Posted by prolix21

i wish my zaino would get here so i can clean up my car. its a big smeared mess right now. ok, its not that bad, and most people might not notice it but i notice. we need a separate support group for owners of black bmw's.

I'll sign up for that support group.

[arnold]

hi, heres some good advise for your swirl marks, go to www.pts106.com check out those pics of cars that was paint protected with this product and contact your local dealer, NASA USA developed this product to protect paint on their equipment. please come back to me with your response , i can guarantee you it will solve your problems, good luck.

warm regards
arnold E90 330i A sport