Notes on a 2011 335is with Stereo (6-speaker) system with a Zapco DC/RF P300 amps

Technic · 11-08-2012, 08:09 AM

Customer made extensive searches in these forums for the most "bang for the buck" upgrade for his 335is disgraceful Stereo system. Then he goes to eBay for a cheap shopping spree after finding out what he needed:

- Focal 100VRS component set (used, in pieces)
- SWS-8Xi (new)
- Zapco DC200.2 (used)
- RF P300-2 (new)

Then he shows up for the install...

Comparison (left to right) between the OEM, the 100VRS and the DLS R4 mids depth:

Front door mid install:

100VRS crossover install (frame removed so it can fit in the E92 door panel) and PnP harness:

OEM tweeter pods installed with VRS oversize tweeter:

Underseat OEM 6.5" woofers replacement:

Pre-mounted SWS-8Xi with OEM woofer connector/spacer (full PnP):

Stereo 2/4 PnP harness installed (no OEM HU removal required):

OEM carpet trimmed to avoid contact with the extended-excursion SWS-8Xi:

RF P300-2 (for the SWS-8Xi) and Navone LOC (low level conversion and remote turn on) installed:

Zapco DC200.2 installed under rear deck:

OEM distribution block double slot available:

Notes:

- This was a very particular Stereo install, as in using a DSP (Zapco DC) only for the front speakers, a bass-boost EQ amp for the SWS-8Xi and OEM HU-powered rear speakers. Results: quite satisfying.

- DC200.2 amp/DSP was tuned to remove the slight OEM HU EQ-curve, to maximize volume while keeping the "gongs" as close to OEM levels as before the amp upgrade. Most of the Stereo amp installs make the gongs volume excessive, and the only way to keep it down to bearable levels is to set the amp gains as minumum as possible. But that kills the volume of the front speakers.

By using the AudioTools iPhone RTA app and the Autosound 2000 test CD white noise track, the OEM HU EQ-curve that tended to boost treble was reversed but with a midbass slight boost with the DC DSP controls. Then the DC electronic gain was set to level the gongs in specific. To finish this up, time alignment was done as well.

This gave an excellent front stage, volume range and clarity. No hiss, no whine. I really liked it.

- The P300-2 is a great, low cost amplifier for the SWS-8Xi (2ohms). No need to adjust gains, just the Punch EQ bass boost. Again, there is no substitute for the ultimate "boom, boom" without a sub than the SWS-8. Midbass is slightly lacking, no matter how much it was boosted at the 100VRS mids via the DC. However, between a high LP filter (200Hz) and Punch EQ relatively high level settings some midbass was artificially increased.

Overall, this was a very smart upgrade from a customer. No unnecessary devices, wiring or disassembly were performed. Just what was required for an effective sound upgrade. And it worked.

Hopeful · 11-13-2012, 03:58 AM

I like the idea of not needing to remove and (struggle to) refit the HU.
Can you explain the wiring layout with the Stereo 2/4 PnP harness please?

Technic · 11-13-2012, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hopeful

I like the idea of not needing to remove and (struggle to) refit the HU.
Can you explain the wiring layout with the Stereo 2/4 PnP harness please?

OEM HU front (2-channel) outputs split into front and underseat (4-channel) speaker inputs.

The same 2/4 configuration as the OEM Alpine OEM amp retrofit.

Hopeful · 11-13-2012, 08:26 AM

Thanks. So, if someone just wants to process/amplify their front mids (with tweeters using a crossover) and underseat speakers, leave the rears to be fed by the HU and forget about adding a front centre speaker, this is the way to go (for simplicity)?

Technic · 11-13-2012, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hopeful

Thanks. So, if someone just wants to process/amplify their front mids (with tweeters using a crossover) and underseat speakers, leave the rears to be fed by the HU and forget about adding a front centre speaker, this is the way to go (for simplicity)?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technic

Notes:

- This was a very particular Stereo install, as in using a DSP (Zapco DC) only for the front speakers, a bass-boost EQ amp for the SWS-8Xi and OEM HU-powered rear speakers. Results: quite satisfying.

Overall, this was a very smart upgrade from a customer. No unnecessary devices, wiring or disassembly were performed. Just what was required for an effective sound upgrade. And it worked.

romanonj · 12-25-2012, 12:00 PM

This is great.. The IS is same as mine, even same interior color.. It's such a shame that car of this caliber comes with such $h1tty system.

I like the idea of adding central speaker, but seems like a lot of taking things apart, and I have tendency to break things (may be its just me)..

I apologize for asking redundant questions, but what does recoding of HU achieve? I read that this is required for alpine retrofit? Was it required for this install?

Did you use stock underseat enclosures, or do I need to get new ones? I have SWS with RF 200/2 left over from my last car which sounded great.

I see adapters used when mounting speakers, where can I get those from?

I don't see any nformation on amplifying rear speakers as well, have you done that? Any depth limitations there, I am looking to put alpine sps410 speakers in the back and amplify them.

Your input is as always much appreciated!!!

ctuna · 12-25-2012, 12:37 PM

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=641323

The reason for recoding is to get rid of the Eq curve that comes with the base radio setup.(this is also done with a flattening processor like a cleansweep ) The details are in the above thread. Some do this with a processor but some try to take the load of the processor by recoding to Hi Fi which gives a flatter output from the Head Unit. If you don't want to use a processor at all just an amp then recoding to Hi Fi does the trick.

A lot of people like traditional stereo and regard the rear speakers as a waste so do not modify . If you like surround sound your opinion may differ but your ears don't point to the rear.

There is a list of speakers that fit and are commonly used
in the above link. You should study that link until you understand exactly what your possibility's are.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=343673

romanonj · 12-26-2012, 01:13 PM

Thanks.. Doing lot of reading.. Listening mostly to 335is exhaust note for now, so stereo upgrade can wait and be planned better...

Any idea on whether stock underseat enclosures can be fitted with SWS? Or do I need to get new ones..

Technic · 12-26-2012, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by romanonj

Thanks.. Doing lot of reading.. Listening mostly to 335is exhaust note for now, so stereo upgrade can wait and be planned better...

Any idea on whether stock underseat enclosures can be fitted with SWS? Or do I need to get new ones..

romanonj · 12-26-2012, 04:00 PM

I studied this pic extensively, and enclosures are different judging by the rib pattern.. It looks as the stock enclosure has clips on both sides holding the woofer in place, so my question is can the woofer be taken out without damaging the box and refitted with SWS subs?

Technic, I am unable to pm you.. Can you please email me with pricing on your wiring harness? Me email rmerkushen@comcast.net

Technic · 12-26-2012, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by romanonj

I studied this pic extensively, and enclosures are different judging by the rib pattern.. It looks as the stock enclosure has clips on both sides holding the woofer in place, so my question is can the woofer be taken out without damaging the box and refitted with SWS subs?

Technic, I am unable to pm you.. Can you please email me with pricing on your wiring harness? Me email rmerkushen@comcast.net

The enclosures exterior shape is slightly different, but the volume and internals are the same. If the OEM woofer is glued to the enclosure then the OEM woofer itself cannot be saved/reused if removed. The enclosure can be used with the SWS-8.

Only PM, please...

romanonj · 12-26-2012, 04:47 PM

Pm sent...

romanonj · 12-28-2012, 07:02 PM

I think I have an idea on what will be done based on tons of good information on this site.. And thank you guys for pointing me to the right places..

I will be keeping stock professional HU, and getting it recoded to the HiFi output. The output from the HU will be hooked into JBL MS-8, which will drive front components, rears, and center speakers. I have not purchase the speakers yet, there is a set available on ebay starting at 200 for the logic 7. If this does not pan out, I will be proceeding with Focal 100VRS components in front, and Focal 100 2ways for center and rear speakers. I already purchased door molding and center grill from Princeton BMW.

The underseat woofers will be replaced with SWS 8xi (2ohm) version that I took out from my old logic 7 e90. I used punch 200/2 amp to drive them in my old car and they sounded great with bass at -4 and 80hz eq almost all the way down, amp gain was set at 50% with bass boost all the way down. Granted logic 7 output was post factory amp and hotter than what MS-8 will be putting out, but I feel 200 watt amp should push this well in 2 ohm stereo (especially underated RFP).

I am hoping to get my hands on Technic harnesses that should make my install a breeze.

What do you guys think on logic 7 speakers? I had mine replaced with BSW and BSW do sound tiny bit better (higher frequencies anyway). I like PNP aspectt with BSW, but their pricing is out of control now. I purchased X3 set last year for 549, which included two component set and one crossover, it is now 699?? Same for base stereo.. Focals cost 499 + 115 for set of 2ways (I need 2).

Regards,
Roman

romanonj · 12-29-2012, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Technic

The enclosures exterior shape is slightly different, but the volume and internals are the same. If the OEM woofer is glued to the enclosure then the OEM woofer itself cannot be saved/reused if removed. The enclosure can be used with the SWS-8.

Only PM, please...

Hey man, did you get my PM?

amilo123 · 06-01-2013, 04:47 AM

Hello,

I am looking into doing this install. Haven't decided on the front speakers, but the underseats will be earthquakes.

My question is, if in the future I will want to change the rear spekers as well, and posibly add another speaker in the dash, couldn't I just use the output from the current wires in the back, connect them to an amp, and then connect the new spekers to that amp? In this scenario I will use only the stereo 2/4 harness and still have amplified back speakers.

Am I missing something?

NorthernCAE90 · 06-01-2013, 01:34 PM

Sweet setup!!!! So disgraceful how BMW downgrades the new models with a 6 speaker setup!!!! Although I think all of us even if we had L7 always look for MORE!!!!

So it probably wouldn't matter because I(and yoU!) would find SOMETHING to upgrade or make louder/better/clearer!

lounnj · 06-13-2013, 11:40 PM

Nice setup for a low budget.

Drone-E92 · 06-14-2013, 02:29 PM

hey technic, please pm me the cost for a plug n play woofer/amp harness for an e92 325i RHD. i jus wana put bass in my trunk.

Technic · 06-14-2013, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drone-E92

hey technic, please pm me the cost for a plug n play woofer/amp harness for an e92 325i RHD. i jus wana put bass in my trunk.

You need to use PM... please do not post your requests in every thread of mine.

tremor1521 · 04-17-2014, 03:14 PM

I want to do this exact setup without the new subs. Does this mean I would only need the following?

Focal 100VRS component set
Zapco DC200.2
Wiring harness

Thank you!

ctuna · 04-17-2014, 07:43 PM

Yes if you can find them
That model is discontinued I believe they have
another model now.
But it would be a pretty unbalanced system on paper .
You really need to do the under seats at the same time.

snaimpally · 04-17-2014, 09:31 PM

I found an authorized dealer with fairly inexpensive ($350) refurbished XD600/6 or M600/6 with factory refurb warranty. Please PM me if you are interested (they are not a forum sponsor so any link I post will likely get deleted).

Technic provides a great service to the BMW community by offering his harness. Makes life so much easier.

11-08-2012, 08:09 AM	#1
Technic Lieutenant General 2466 Rep 13,125 Posts Drives: 2025 Countryman S, 2024 i4 M50 Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Florida iTrader: (18)	Notes on a 2011 335is with Stereo (6-speaker) system with a Zapco DC/RF P300 amps Customer made extensive searches in these forums for the most "bang for the buck" upgrade for his 335is disgraceful Stereo system. Then he goes to eBay for a cheap shopping spree after finding out what he needed: - Focal 100VRS component set (used, in pieces) - SWS-8Xi (new) - Zapco DC200.2 (used) - RF P300-2 (new) Then he shows up for the install... Comparison (left to right) between the OEM, the 100VRS and the DLS R4 mids depth: Front door mid install: 100VRS crossover install (frame removed so it can fit in the E92 door panel) and PnP harness: OEM tweeter pods installed with VRS oversize tweeter: Underseat OEM 6.5" woofers replacement: Pre-mounted SWS-8Xi with OEM woofer connector/spacer (full PnP): Stereo 2/4 PnP harness installed (no OEM HU removal required): OEM carpet trimmed to avoid contact with the extended-excursion SWS-8Xi: RF P300-2 (for the SWS-8Xi) and Navone LOC (low level conversion and remote turn on) installed: Zapco DC200.2 installed under rear deck: OEM distribution block double slot available: Notes: - This was a very particular Stereo install, as in using a DSP (Zapco DC) only for the front speakers, a bass-boost EQ amp for the SWS-8Xi and OEM HU-powered rear speakers. Results: quite satisfying. - DC200.2 amp/DSP was tuned to remove the slight OEM HU EQ-curve, to maximize volume while keeping the "gongs" as close to OEM levels as before the amp upgrade. Most of the Stereo amp installs make the gongs volume excessive, and the only way to keep it down to bearable levels is to set the amp gains as minumum as possible. But that kills the volume of the front speakers. By using the AudioTools iPhone RTA app and the Autosound 2000 test CD white noise track, the OEM HU EQ-curve that tended to boost treble was reversed but with a midbass slight boost with the DC DSP controls. Then the DC electronic gain was set to level the gongs in specific. To finish this up, time alignment was done as well. This gave an excellent front stage, volume range and clarity. No hiss, no whine. I really liked it. - The P300-2 is a great, low cost amplifier for the SWS-8Xi (2ohms). No need to adjust gains, just the Punch EQ bass boost. Again, there is no substitute for the ultimate "boom, boom" without a sub than the SWS-8. Midbass is slightly lacking, no matter how much it was boosted at the 100VRS mids via the DC. However, between a high LP filter (200Hz) and Punch EQ relatively high level settings some midbass was artificially increased. Overall, this was a very smart upgrade from a customer. No unnecessary devices, wiring or disassembly were performed. Just what was required for an effective sound upgrade. And it worked. Last edited by Technic; 11-08-2012 at 09:23 AM..
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11-13-2012, 03:58 AM	#2
Hopeful Second Lieutenant 46 Rep 217 Posts Drives: BMW X3 G01 30d 2018 Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Dorset iTrader: (0)	I like the idea of not needing to remove and (struggle to) refit the HU. Can you explain the wiring layout with the Stereo 2/4 PnP harness please?
	Appreciate 0

11-13-2012, 08:26 AM	#4
Hopeful Second Lieutenant 46 Rep 217 Posts Drives: BMW X3 G01 30d 2018 Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Dorset iTrader: (0)	Thanks. So, if someone just wants to process/amplify their front mids (with tweeters using a crossover) and underseat speakers, leave the rears to be fed by the HU and forget about adding a front centre speaker, this is the way to go (for simplicity)?
	Appreciate 0

12-25-2012, 12:00 PM	#6
romanonj Major 150 Rep 1,316 Posts Drives: F80 DCT Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: New Jersey, Ocean County iTrader: (18)	This is great.. The IS is same as mine, even same interior color.. It's such a shame that car of this caliber comes with such $h1tty system. I like the idea of adding central speaker, but seems like a lot of taking things apart, and I have tendency to break things (may be its just me).. I apologize for asking redundant questions, but what does recoding of HU achieve? I read that this is required for alpine retrofit? Was it required for this install? Did you use stock underseat enclosures, or do I need to get new ones? I have SWS with RF 200/2 left over from my last car which sounded great. I see adapters used when mounting speakers, where can I get those from? I don't see any nformation on amplifying rear speakers as well, have you done that? Any depth limitations there, I am looking to put alpine sps410 speakers in the back and amplify them. Your input is as always much appreciated!!!
	Appreciate 0

12-25-2012, 12:37 PM	#7
ctuna Lieutenant General 2027 Rep 13,331 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	FYI http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=641323 The reason for recoding is to get rid of the Eq curve that comes with the base radio setup.(this is also done with a flattening processor like a cleansweep ) The details are in the above thread. Some do this with a processor but some try to take the load of the processor by recoding to Hi Fi which gives a flatter output from the Head Unit. If you don't want to use a processor at all just an amp then recoding to Hi Fi does the trick. A lot of people like traditional stereo and regard the rear speakers as a waste so do not modify . If you like surround sound your opinion may differ but your ears don't point to the rear. There is a list of speakers that fit and are commonly used in the above link. You should study that link until you understand exactly what your possibility's are. http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=343673 Last edited by ctuna; 12-25-2012 at 01:04 PM..
	Appreciate 0

12-26-2012, 01:13 PM	#8
romanonj Major 150 Rep 1,316 Posts Drives: F80 DCT Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: New Jersey, Ocean County iTrader: (18)	Thanks.. Doing lot of reading.. Listening mostly to 335is exhaust note for now, so stereo upgrade can wait and be planned better... Any idea on whether stock underseat enclosures can be fitted with SWS? Or do I need to get new ones.. __________________ 2016 F80 M3 BSM with Black interior DCT/Driver Assistance/Executive/LEDs/Adaptive/Black Wheels 2014 F32 435i xDrive AW/CR 2014 F25 X3 M-Sport Carbon Black 2011 e92 335is 2007 X3 122k miles 2006 e90 330i 132k miles
	Appreciate 0

12-26-2012, 04:00 PM	#10
romanonj Major 150 Rep 1,316 Posts Drives: F80 DCT Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: New Jersey, Ocean County iTrader: (18)	I studied this pic extensively, and enclosures are different judging by the rib pattern.. It looks as the stock enclosure has clips on both sides holding the woofer in place, so my question is can the woofer be taken out without damaging the box and refitted with SWS subs? Technic, I am unable to pm you.. Can you please email me with pricing on your wiring harness? Me email rmerkushen@comcast.net __________________ 2016 F80 M3 BSM with Black interior DCT/Driver Assistance/Executive/LEDs/Adaptive/Black Wheels 2014 F32 435i xDrive AW/CR 2014 F25 X3 M-Sport Carbon Black 2011 e92 335is 2007 X3 122k miles 2006 e90 330i 132k miles
	Appreciate 0

12-26-2012, 04:47 PM	#12
romanonj Major 150 Rep 1,316 Posts Drives: F80 DCT Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: New Jersey, Ocean County iTrader: (18)	Pm sent... __________________ 2016 F80 M3 BSM with Black interior DCT/Driver Assistance/Executive/LEDs/Adaptive/Black Wheels 2014 F32 435i xDrive AW/CR 2014 F25 X3 M-Sport Carbon Black 2011 e92 335is 2007 X3 122k miles 2006 e90 330i 132k miles
	Appreciate 0

12-28-2012, 07:02 PM	#13
romanonj Major 150 Rep 1,316 Posts Drives: F80 DCT Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: New Jersey, Ocean County iTrader: (18)	I think I have an idea on what will be done based on tons of good information on this site.. And thank you guys for pointing me to the right places.. I will be keeping stock professional HU, and getting it recoded to the HiFi output. The output from the HU will be hooked into JBL MS-8, which will drive front components, rears, and center speakers. I have not purchase the speakers yet, there is a set available on ebay starting at 200 for the logic 7. If this does not pan out, I will be proceeding with Focal 100VRS components in front, and Focal 100 2ways for center and rear speakers. I already purchased door molding and center grill from Princeton BMW. The underseat woofers will be replaced with SWS 8xi (2ohm) version that I took out from my old logic 7 e90. I used punch 200/2 amp to drive them in my old car and they sounded great with bass at -4 and 80hz eq almost all the way down, amp gain was set at 50% with bass boost all the way down. Granted logic 7 output was post factory amp and hotter than what MS-8 will be putting out, but I feel 200 watt amp should push this well in 2 ohm stereo (especially underated RFP). I am hoping to get my hands on Technic harnesses that should make my install a breeze. What do you guys think on logic 7 speakers? I had mine replaced with BSW and BSW do sound tiny bit better (higher frequencies anyway). I like PNP aspectt with BSW, but their pricing is out of control now. I purchased X3 set last year for 549, which included two component set and one crossover, it is now 699?? Same for base stereo.. Focals cost 499 + 115 for set of 2ways (I need 2). Regards, Roman __________________ 2016 F80 M3 BSM with Black interior DCT/Driver Assistance/Executive/LEDs/Adaptive/Black Wheels 2014 F32 435i xDrive AW/CR 2014 F25 X3 M-Sport Carbon Black 2011 e92 335is 2007 X3 122k miles 2006 e90 330i 132k miles
	Appreciate 0

06-01-2013, 04:47 AM	#15
amilo123 Enlisted Member 15 Rep 38 Posts Drives: 318i Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Romania iTrader: (0)	Hello, I am looking into doing this install. Haven't decided on the front speakers, but the underseats will be earthquakes. My question is, if in the future I will want to change the rear spekers as well, and posibly add another speaker in the dash, couldn't I just use the output from the current wires in the back, connect them to an amp, and then connect the new spekers to that amp? In this scenario I will use only the stereo 2/4 harness and still have amplified back speakers. Am I missing something?
	Appreciate 0

06-01-2013, 01:34 PM	#16
NorthernCAE90 First Lieutenant 25 Rep 354 Posts Drives: 2006 BMW 325I Join Date: May 2013 Location: Modesto, CA iTrader: (0)	Sweet setup!!!! So disgraceful how BMW downgrades the new models with a 6 speaker setup!!!! Although I think all of us even if we had L7 always look for MORE!!!! So it probably wouldn't matter because I(and yoU!) would find SOMETHING to upgrade or make louder/better/clearer!
	Appreciate 0

06-13-2013, 11:40 PM	#17
lounnj Newbie 0 Rep 13 Posts Drives: BMW 2009 x5 E70 Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: North Jersey USA iTrader: (0)	Nice setup for a low budget.
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06-14-2013, 02:29 PM	#18
Drone-E92 Private 7 Rep 90 Posts Drives: black e92 325i Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: kgn-jamaica/Florida-US iTrader: (0)	hey technic, please pm me the cost for a plug n play woofer/amp harness for an e92 325i RHD. i jus wana put bass in my trunk.
	Appreciate 0

04-17-2014, 03:14 PM	#20
tremor1521 Private 7 Rep 52 Posts Drives: 2011 E90 328i 6MT Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: United States iTrader: (0)	I want to do this exact setup without the new subs. Does this mean I would only need the following? Focal 100VRS component set Zapco DC200.2 Wiring harness Thank you!
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04-17-2014, 07:43 PM	#21
ctuna Lieutenant General 2027 Rep 13,331 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	Yes if you can find them Yes if you can find them That model is discontinued I believe they have another model now. But it would be a pretty unbalanced system on paper . You really need to do the under seats at the same time.
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04-17-2014, 09:31 PM	#22
snaimpally Major 170 Rep 1,247 Posts Drives: 2022 F44 M235i GC Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Austin, TX iTrader: (9) Garage List 2022 M235i [0.00]	I found an authorized dealer with fairly inexpensive ($350) refurbished XD600/6 or M600/6 with factory refurb warranty. Please PM me if you are interested (they are not a forum sponsor so any link I post will likely get deleted). Technic provides a great service to the BMW community by offering his harness. Makes life so much easier.
	Appreciate 0