[AGuyNamedGore_335i]

Hey guys i was wondering how much e85 i can run safe on stock turbos with not FF wire

[jgoens]

Yeah, Ive been wondering the same thing. I just have JB4 and the rest is stock. I tried a mix of half 91 and half 100 and then put two gallons of e85 last week and on map 5 it felt fast but I don't know if it was faster for sure. Some people say to try little by little and see how it runs.

[CantCatchMe]

E30 is the magic number. After that if you want to run more I'd get Stage 2 LPFP from Fuel It. Why not get the flex wires?

[SRT14PimPin07]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe 2-2.5 gallons of E85 is the most should do without flex fuel wires....

[CantCatchMe]

You are correct, that's why I'm wondering if he wants to run more why not get the wires and LPFP.

[Jamesv]

Originally Posted by AGuyNamedGore_335i

Hey guys i was wondering how much e85 i can run safe on stock turbos with not FF wire

I run 4/16 gallons of e85 for a mix of 25%, on an empty tank. I usually wait till its 1/4 tank, and put 3 gal of e85, and the rest CA premium 91. The octane is about 94.5. It runs smoother, and doesn't have any problems. Oh and I have a n52. I just do it to up the octane for motor smoothness, since we can't get 93 octane here in CA.

[AJ9x]

I've read E20-E25 is most you should do without the wires. E40-E45 with wires (LPFP limited).

[jgoens]

After doing further research, I think I am going to go with the ff wires. Apparently e85 causes the engine to run lean which is probably not a good thing for long term
And I wouldn't mind seeing what a little extra e85 can do from time to time. I did notice with last week's blend that the car was a little jumpy as in the power would suddenly hit around 2500 rpm.

[AJ9x]

Originally Posted by jgoens

After doing further research, I think I am going to go with the ff wires. Apparently e85 causes the engine to run lean which is probably not a good thing for long term
And I wouldn't mind seeing what a little extra e85 can do from time to time. I did notice with last week's blend that the car was a little jumpy as in the power would suddenly hit around 2500 rpm.

Flex Fuel wires are good, but getting to the fuel rail sensor where it hooks up is a pain in the butt. Had to monkey with the back engine cover and get a little lucky to get the wires installed. That being said, you should be ok around E40 afterwards. More than E45, you're looking at a new LPFP and possibly a back-end flash. From my understanding, JB4 can get screwy beyond E45 without it (but it'll lock you into requiring E85 from then on out).

[FA335i]

Originally Posted by CantCatchMe

E30 is the magic number. After that if you want to run more I'd get Stage 2 LPFP from Fuel It. Why not get the flex wires?

I run 3g e85 which is e30 mix on a 8gall tank.

[924er]

There is no magic number about how much e85 you can run it all depends on the tuning and if your maxing your fuel trims. Ask PTF or wedge. Many are running e50 with a stock LPFP but they are sacrificing a lot of mid range power

Sure on a jb4 or a map not meant to run e85 I wouldn't run more than 30%. I did this for the longest on 93 maps when I only had access to 91 octane

The best way to go about running e85 is a custom tune via COBB. I wouldn't risk it with just a piggyback.

[Physics]

Originally Posted by 924er

There is no magic number about how much e85 you can run it all depends on the tuning and if your maxing your fuel trims. Ask PTF or wedge. Many are running e50 with a stock LPFP but they are sacrificing a lot of mid range power

Sure on a jb4 or a map not meant to run e85 I wouldn't run more than 30%. I did this for the longest on 93 maps when I only had access to 91 octane

The best way to go about running e85 is a custom tune via COBB. I wouldn't risk it with just a piggyback.

Only correct post in this thread.

I run E50 on stock pumps but am tuned for it via PTF. STFT & LTFT (fuel trims) are within acceptable ranges. An Exx tune has everything your normal tune (boost, torque, load tables, etc) would have but concentrates more on fuel scalars and timing. Stock pumps can handle E50 mix. No more, though.

[924er]

Originally Posted by Physics

Only correct post in this thread.

I run E50 on stock pumps but am tuned for it via PTF. STFT & LTFT (fuel trims) are within acceptable ranges. An Exx tune has everything your normal tune (boost, torque, load tables, etc) would have but concentrates more on fuel scalars and timing. Stock pumps can handle E50 mix. No more, though.

I'm looking to run e50, how do you like it? Is it your daily driver?

I drive my car 50 miles a day to work sometimes my car never sees boost so idk if it's worth it yet plus I'm still running dealer run flats. Might get a 91 octane tune first then maybe down the line get an e50 and switch between the two.

[csu87]

Question for you guys, does the N55 have a bigger fuel pump than the n54 to allow you to run up to e50 mixes? Or is it just the characteristics of the engine that allow it.

[Physics]

Originally Posted by 924er

I'm looking to run e50, how do you like it? Is it your daily driver?

I drive my car 50 miles a day to work sometimes my car never sees boost so idk if it's worth it yet plus I'm still running dealer run flats. Might get a 91 octane tune first then maybe down the line get an e50 and switch between the two.

I'll address these in order.

1. E50 is a world of difference. Apparently i'm the only one who believes in metrics in the N55 world, so i've dyno each stage of development in my build (Cobb Stage 2+, PTF 93 oct and PTF E50). E50 is a 20-30 whp increase and a good 50 wtq increase. It's not like when you first tuned your car. It's better.

2. I have an Accord as my daily now that i've seriously began to build the N55 platform (upgrading turbo, LSD, etc.). However, before this i did have the Bimmer as my daily. That's why i opted for the pump 93 oct PTF tune first.

3. E50 characteristics...Cons - When running higher concentrations of ethanol, mpg goes out the window. Like me, you commute a good deal to work and will literally see your gas disappear along the way. Gear shifts are not as smooth, either, due to the power and low-end torque available in every gear (can be a bit jerky). Pros - The car is a completely different animal. I haven't put plain 93 back in since E50 came along

[Physics]

Originally Posted by csu87

Question for you guys, does the N55 have a bigger fuel pump than the n54 to allow you to run up to e50 mixes? Or is it just the characteristics of the engine that allow it.

Define "bigger". Volumetric Capacity? No. It has the fuel pumps later N54's have and those N54 that kept having to replace their outdated and malfunctioning pumps (dealer should have swapped in the new pump models for the old ones).

[924er]

Originally Posted by Physics

I'll address these in order.

1. E50 is a world of difference. Apparently i'm the only one who believes in metrics in the N55 world, so i've dyno each stage of development in my build (Cobb Stage 2+, PTF 93 oct and PTF E50). E50 is a 20-30 whp increase and a good 50 wtq increase. It's not like when you first tuned your car. It's better.

2. I have an Accord as my daily now that i've seriously began to build the N55 platform (upgrading turbo, LSD, etc.). However, before this i did have the Bimmer as my daily. That's why i opted for the pump 93 oct PTF tune first.

3. E50 characteristics...Cons - When running higher concentrations of ethanol, mpg goes out the window. Like me, you commute a good deal to work and will literally see your gas disappear along the way. Gear shifts are not as smooth, either, due to the power and low-end torque available in every gear (can be a bit jerky). Pros - The car is a completely different animal. I haven't put plain 93 back in since E50 came along

Is believe it. Just running Cobb e30 I feel the difference!

So based off what ur saying it's probably best to get a pump gas tune for a daily driver and an e50 tune for when I feel like ripping it.

[proTUNING Freaks]

Originally Posted by 924er

Is believe it. Just running Cobb e30 I feel the difference!

So based off what ur saying it's probably best to get a pump gas tune for a daily driver and an e50 tune for when I feel like ripping it.

924er, what you're referring to on your car is in regards to the N54 motor on OEM twin turbos, different beast compared to the N55 with the OEM single turbo. Just FYI

[mike5809]

Originally Posted by Physics

I'll address these in order.

1. E50 is a world of difference. Apparently i'm the only one who believes in metrics in the N55 world, so i've dyno each stage of development in my build (Cobb Stage 2+, PTF 93 oct and PTF E50). E50 is a 20-30 whp increase and a good 50 wtq increase. It's not like when you first tuned your car. It's better.

I am looking for PTF to create a new E85 Map for me. I am FBO (Intake, CP, FMIC, DP) currently running a custom map from PTF, based on 93 Octane. Have you had any issues running an E50 blend? I am somewhat surprised you can run E50 without any fuel upgrades.

I was thinking of running a custom E85 map with at most 4 Gal of E85, which would put me at about E30 / 96 Octane. E50 would be more about 8 Gal / 99 Octane - if the fuel system can handle a map like that then even better .

Just curious as your experience thus far.

[Physics]

Originally Posted by 924er

Is believe it. Just running Cobb e30 I feel the difference!

So based off what ur saying it's probably best to get a pump gas tune for a daily driver and an e50 tune for when I feel like ripping it.

There is no Cobb e30 for an N55. Race maps where never developed for us, unfortunately. I'd expect you to get better gains than us, given the restrictive nature of our turbo's airflow.

[Physics]

Originally Posted by mike5809

I am looking for PTF to create a new E85 Map for me. I am FBO (Intake, CP, FMIC, DP) currently running a custom map from PTF, based on 93 Octane. Have you had any issues running an E50 blend? I am somewhat surprised you can run E50 without any fuel upgrades.

I was thinking of running a custom E85 map with at most 4 Gal of E85, which would put me at about E30 / 96 Octane. E50 would be more about 8 Gal / 99 Octane - if the fuel system can handle a map like that then even better .

Just curious as your experience thus far.

Well, I put around 9-10 gallons of E85, the rest is 93, to achieve an E50 map. Keep in mind that with the Cobb AP we have no ability to track lpfp and hpfp health directly. You have to infer it from the logs.

There has been some hiccups along the way, but nothing major. The N55 platform is overly sensitive, much more than our younger counterpart. There's a lot more fail safes in place and a lot more triggers that can be pushed. We've ran into over boosting problems and some limp mode sensitivity. But thats to be expected in any tuning experience. I've also pushed Dzenno pretty hard with demands of smooth power delivery, less lag, and power demand while remaining reliable. He's met every one of them. But it has taken a while.

[jgoens]

Damn..I put 5 gal in today of e85...to make the tank full
Car runs fine. I get nervous putting more and more in....did a couple runs and it moves well but I can't say for sure if it is that much faster. I'm still experimenting. It does feel to have a little better throttle response. So I guess I am at e40?