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      05-19-2022, 12:27 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by Bumpinjeep View Post
To this day, I still think BMW should have invested in the "iS" sub-brand. 340iS, X4iS, X5iS, would have been freaking awesome. None of this lower case "m" crap. This whole 'follow the leader' nonsense has to stop, I get that Audi and Mercedes-AMG are doing it, but BMW as a brand should do better. Oh well, at least they still offer a manual in their performance cars.
I had a e92 335is and loved that car, but it always bothered me that it had a M logos on it like on the door sills. I was perfectly happy with it, especially after installing coilovers, FMIC w/tune, wider wheels/tires, strut brace, etc. It was a beast, but it wasn’t an M car. What it was IMO was the best damn 3 Series they made.
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      05-19-2022, 07:07 PM   #68
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IMO that confirms the power dome is not needed to clear the engine.
Clear the engine ≠ Engine Clearance.

G42/87 have a substantial decrease in front overhang compared to the other 35up models but the engine clearance must be preserved for when one of you jackasses mows down a pedestrian, their skull won't necessarily split like a melon.
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      05-21-2022, 08:18 PM   #69
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For years BMW marketing distinguished M cars from the rest of their lineup as being the top of the line performance models. They not only touted all the performance features, but went out of their way to point out all the aggressive styling cues only found on an M car.

Over the past decade they started badging non-M cars with the M logo, then making M-lite models all the way up to the current M240i which has M logos all over it, M mirrors and a power dome. Now they're putting quad exhaust on non-M cars? If you go to BMWs website and click on M and you'll see these 'M-lite' models listed as M models.

I get that they're whoring out the M brand to sell cars, but they are literally cannibalizing every aesthetic feature that separated out an M car from the rest. Makes no sense to me.

BMW 1 Series Spied With Quad Exhaust Tips, Could Be M140i

the msport cars have been around for decades.

the real issue is that bmw does not use optimized rear wheel drive platform anymore. This kills the pure sport car and you get volume manufacturer. At this point M is severely impacted unlike ever before because of what's under the skin. Cosmetics are irrelevant at this point.

May want to read details of clar platform and the new one called Neue Klasse that is coming out by '25.
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      05-22-2022, 06:13 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by Tag View Post
I had a e92 335is and loved that car, but it always bothered me that it had a M logos on it like on the door sills. I was perfectly happy with it, especially after installing coilovers, FMIC w/tune, wider wheels/tires, strut brace, etc. It was a beast, but it wasn’t an M car. What it was IMO was the best damn 3 Series they made.
It had M logos on the door sills, steering wheel and rims because it had the M Sport package. M Technic/ M Sport pkgs have been on offer for many decades. Nothing wrong with them at all. Well, it's gone a bit wrong lately, though, because they've added more M logos, mirrors, etc. to non-M GmbH products.

I agree that the "is" model designation should've been continued to this day. However, ///Marketing dictates otherwise, sadly.
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      05-22-2022, 07:48 AM   #71
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I think my E30 325is only had these steering wheel stripes. Isn't M Performance a substantially similar equipment upgrade?

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      05-23-2022, 10:38 AM   #72
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Doesn't bother me.I have no problem if BMW wants to put the full real round quad exhaust pipes on all M performance vehicles.They look great.
The round exhaust is reserved for full M cars only, as you can see in the previously mentioned video clip @14m38s.
16:07-16:17

It's not an M240. It's an M2. Just the 40 version.

Suddenly it all makes sense 😬😬
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      06-21-2022, 10:31 AM   #73
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https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=29033250

Next X3 M40 or M50 will also have the quad pipes. So we should get used to this for all upcoming M performance models
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      06-21-2022, 11:19 AM   #74
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https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=29033250

Next X3 M40 or M50 will also have the quad pipes. So we should get used to this for all upcoming M performance models
Any news on when the 2 Series Gran Coupe gets the S58? Maybe for the LCI model?
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      06-21-2022, 11:26 AM   #75
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Did you know some BMW models still offer DCT? For instance, the 2023 X1 has a seven speed DCT. Meanwhile M cars get a slushbox.

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      06-21-2022, 12:26 PM   #76
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Did you know some BMW models still offer DCT? For instance, the 2023 X1 has a seven speed DCT. Meanwhile M cars get a slushbox.

It's because DCT pairs w the FWD architecture... its not the Getrag M DCT we are used to for fwd architecures... I wouldn't be at all surprised if this isn't the same as the VW DCTs... mini is the same.

The ZF8 is made specifically for rwd architectures... and they were to cheap to keep the rwd dct.
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      06-21-2022, 12:30 PM   #77
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Also... I think all of the current M cars are solid. There is definitely some cheapness going on and a lot of weight bloating but they are still some of the best cars you can buy.

What does get me is the BS marketing... the M sport cars are not M cars however it seems BMW has really stepped their game up on the M performance cars and really hasn't progressed the actual M cars much at all.

Case in point... look at brand new X3 M40i vs X3M comp... both pretty much look identical right now... the M comp has a slightly better suspension and more power... great... tune the B58 and ur awfully close.
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      06-21-2022, 01:02 PM   #78
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I've always felt BMW made their M-lites too good and close to the full M cars; they are too powerful, too fast, sound too good and too close to the range-topping model.

The fact that a mapped 340i will keep up with an M3 or worse, a mapped 240i will outgun an M2 is a failure on BMWs part for me. Yeah, I know cornering blah blah but 95% of drivers will never go on a race track and don't know shit about handling dynamics other than going around a round-about 60mph.

It's not just BMW; Audi does it as well with their S models, my mate's S3 with a map and some exhaust mods is quicker than an RS3. I've seen mapped S4s beating RS4s.

I get why they do it, but they make them too close, IMO; even stock for stock, there isn't a huge difference. It should be night and day, I think.
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      06-21-2022, 01:27 PM   #79
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I agree. Honestly if the M340i came in manual, I'd probably choose it over the M2. Just fits a personal need better. Plus, M3 is out of my budget.
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      06-21-2022, 01:34 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///MFrankie View Post
I've always felt BMW made their M-lites too good and close to the full M cars; they are too powerful, too fast, sound too good and too close to the range-topping model.

The fact that a mapped 340i will keep up with an M3 or worse, a mapped 240i will outgun an M2 is a failure on BMWs part for me. Yeah, I know cornering blah blah but 95% of drivers will never go on a race track and don't know shit about handling dynamics other than going around a round-about 60mph.

It's not just BMW; Audi does it as well with their S models, my mate's S3 with a map and some exhaust mods is quicker than an RS3. I've seen mapped S4s beating RS4s.

I get why they do it, but they make them too close, IMO; even stock for stock, there isn't a huge difference. It should be night and day, I think.
Right... this started around the E90 Generation...

When tuned 335s could beat NA M3s.

This was further continued by the B58 340s of which some had 380 hp w mpkk vs the F80s.

And now? cmon
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      06-21-2022, 02:01 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
Right... this started around the E90 Generation...

When tuned 335s could beat NA M3s.

This was further continued by the B58 340s of which some had 380 hp w mpkk vs the F80s.

And now? cmon
Yeah, you're right, it did. I remember that N/A V8 getting gapped by mapped 335i and ds those things were rapid with a basic map, torque for days.

The B58 is an amazing engine, again, if anything it's too good for what it is, this is a testament to the engineers that build them.

You could argue that this new generation M is the first time that it really is the performance it should be, they didn't hold back with the S58 and went all in. So they should.

That being said, I've seen a mapped 240i almost keep up with a stock G80 M3 Comp... Almost.

That B58 has been giving M owners nightmares for a long time
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      06-21-2022, 02:18 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by ///MFrankie View Post
Yeah, you're right, it did. I remember that N/A V8 getting gapped by mapped 335i and ds those things were rapid with a basic map, torque for days.

The B58 is an amazing engine, again, if anything it's too good for what it is, this is a testament to the engineers that build them.

You could argue that this new generation M is the first time that it really is the performance it should be, they didn't hold back with the S58 and went all in. So they should.

That being said, I've seen a mapped 240i almost keep up with a stock G80 M3 Comp... Almost.

That B58 has been giving M owners nightmares for a long time
My daily driver is a F32 with the B58 and MPPSK. I had intentions of tuning it once the warranty expired, but to be honest I'm perfectly happy with it. That's how good it is from factory.
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      06-21-2022, 02:25 PM   #83
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My daily driver is a F32 with the B58 and MPPSK. I had intentions of tuning it once the warranty expired, but to be honest I'm perfectly happy with it. That's how good it is from factory.
Amazing engine and an amazing car.

My mate took me in his F32 340i, and I couldn't fault it tbh, the interior is 90% an M3, and it's blasphemy to say this, but it drove better and pulled harder than the M4 comp I drove.

Sorry not sorry

I reckon with a remap, that thing would be brutal.
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      06-21-2022, 03:39 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
Right... this started around the E90 Generation...

When tuned 335s could beat NA M3s.

This was further continued by the B58 340s of which some had 380 hp w mpkk vs the F80s.

And now? cmon
Yeah, you're right, it did. I remember that N/A V8 getting gapped by mapped 335i and ds those things were rapid with a basic map, torque for days.

The B58 is an amazing engine, again, if anything it's too good for what it is, this is a testament to the engineers that build them.

You could argue that this new generation M is the first time that it really is the performance it should be, they didn't hold back with the S58 and went all in. So they should.

That being said, I've seen a mapped 240i almost keep up with a stock G80 M3 Comp... Almost.

That B58 has been giving M owners nightmares for a long time
Recall how major the difference was between the E46 330i and the E46 M3...
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      06-21-2022, 05:12 PM   #85
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Recall how major the difference was between the E46 330i and the E46 M3...
To be fair, the E46 ZHP 330i had a pretty dedicated following.

I don't think there's any world in which these cars are all turbocharged and cars one level down don't match the cars above them in a straight line with a tune. That's just the nature of turbocharged cars.
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      06-21-2022, 05:53 PM   #86
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I dont know it dose not seem that confusing atleast not compared to othere car manufactures.

It prity strait forward i think the confusing part is that some generations or lesser then otheres. G series appears to be the pinicle to go out on a high note as they transtion away from ICE.
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      06-21-2022, 06:18 PM   #87
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Case in point... look at brand new X3 M40i vs X3M comp... both pretty much look identical right now... the M comp has a slightly better suspension and more power... great... tune the B58 and ur awfully close.
True. The X3 M rides like a Mars rover though. The M40 is the truly the preferred model if you required a comfortable ride in a BMW SAV.


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To be fair, the E46 ZHP 330i had a pretty dedicated following.
It still does. http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/activity.php

Last edited by T_U_D; 06-21-2022 at 06:23 PM..
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      06-21-2022, 06:18 PM   #88
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
Recall how major the difference was between the E46 330i and the E46 M3...
To be fair, the E46 ZHP 330i had a pretty dedicated following.

I don't think there's any world in which these cars are all turbocharged and cars one level down don't match the cars above them in a straight line with a tune. That's just the nature of turbocharged cars.
There is-

An ECU w unbeatable encryption and one that shuts down the moment outside parameters i.e. a jb4 show values above stock.

Again... not really the right answer for us enthusiasts but...
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