[beardman]

Hi All,
My name is Ryan and I'm an alcoholi....N54 owner. Sorry for the long post but I just figured I'd try to give as much info as possible up front.

I have a 2008 335i automatic (pre oil cooler). I've had the car for the last 8 years, it has a little less than 90k miles. No tunes, bone stock, and other than a water pump about 4 years ago, the car has been exceptionally reliable for me until now with just basic maintenance like valve cleaning, plugs, fluid changes and so on.

A few weeks back my wife was driving it to work in traffic, she said she went to accelerate and the car died. She restarted and car would sputter and die. She was pointed downhill so she was able to coast to the side of the road and we had it towed back to our garage.

I pulled codes and saw 2F6C, CDA6, and 2AAF. I was not very smart at this point. I saw "fuel pump" in the code descriptions of CDA6 and 2AAF. Knowing my car's history, and knowing the HPFP and LPFP issues I made a snap judgement and ordered both, along with both high and low pressure sensors and swapped all 4 components out. To my surprise and anger at myself for just spending like 1400$ in BMW parts...no change.

So at that point I started actually reading and I thought EKPS might be bad. I happened to be going to the junkyard that day and I found a 335i wrecked, so I pulled its EKPS module. Swapped it in the car, took it out of "accident mode" or whatever state it was in and...still no change.

What I don't understand is when I open the door I don't hear my fuel pump prime like I am almost positive it always used to do. However, using my basic scan tool ( schwaben foxwell 14020SCH ) I can turn the pump on and off no problem (this is true with both EKPS modules, one from my car or the one from junkyard).

I'm down to thinking it is something electrical but I really am not sure where to start. I replaced the battery too since it was really old but again no change. I used to have INPA set up on a laptop but when it was stolen, I grabbed the foxwell for simplicity's sake. So if absolutely necessary I can set up INPA again.

The only other symptom that basically contradicts half of what I just said is it seems like the engine is flooding, like when I crank if it catches for a few seconds it's just pushing raw fuel and smoking up the garage in those few seconds.

If anyone has any ideas where to go from here please let me know...I'd really like to get back on the road. I've been driving my old diesel truck around and at current fuel prices it is rough on the wallet. I can narrow a 9 inch rear in a morning but this electrical stuff in my BMW has me pretty stumped. Beers for anyone who can help for sure! Thanks, -Ryan

[Aceway]

Is the Foxwell tool able to code the ekp module to your car? Might be the issue, plugging new module in won't work without coding. I used protools to code mine when it was replaced.

[beardman]

I don't think my scan tool can code, I'll buy ProTool and I will give that a try. I figured if my scan tool could talk to the module and make the fuel pump turn on then all was good. Sounds like my scan tool talking to the EKPS and the computer talking to it are different situations.

[kfollowwill]

I hope you find the issue. I am dealing with something similar. Good luck!

[dpaul]

Originally Posted by beardman

I don't think my scan tool can code, I'll buy ProTool and I will give that a try. I figured if my scan tool could talk to the module and make the fuel pump turn on then all was good. Sounds like my scan tool talking to the EKPS and the computer talking to it are different situations.

AFAIK you should not need to code the EKP if it was removed from a car with the same chassis. This assumes the EKP you pulled is ACTUALLY correct and CORRECTLY functional. Who knows? INPA could tell you in 10 seconds.

Your codes might be informative. To begin with, you have not indicated whether these are current or stored codes. Look for that info in the freeze frame data from the Foxwell.

If they are current, CDA6 means the DME cannot receive CAN bus packets from the EKP. That's hard to square with the fact that both DME and EKP both seem to be able to communicate with the Foxwell. So together, these data argue for a programming or coding incompatibility.

This is one of those rare cases where 2AAF is actually meaningful. You may know that BMW directs the code to be ignored UNLESS it is accompanied by other fuel codes, which here it is. It means the DME feels the signal from the low pressure sensor is implausible i.e. fuel delivery rate is too low. The ISTA suggestion is to compare actual fuel pressure (unfortunately requiring special tools) with the pressure that the DME is reporting. My SWAG is that if you had INPA it would indicate well below the nominal 70psi. Consistent but not convincingly diagnostic of an EKP problem.

In your shoes, I'd use WinKFP to update EKP programming in accordance with my chassis then use NCSExpert to default code it to my chassis. It would take about 10 minutes to accomplish this. I wouldn't buy Protool because it has no equivalent functions for WinKFP and if I was ever confused by some German terminology in INPA I'd just search for posts by gbalthrop explaining it and try to enjoy the learning experience.

[beardman]

Thanks for the advice dpaul, I went ahead and ordered a new cable and installed inpa. I know I should have probably just done that in the first place. Now I'm going through the inpa learning curve again. I went over to my shop last night and plugged the computer in and was at least able to read some codes so I think I'm on track with my inpa install at least.

I read MSD80 error memory and it had :2F6C, 2AAF, and CD87.

I read the MSD80 info memory with environment and it had : 2FCA, 2FDA, and 2AD0.

For the heck of it I tried to connect to the EKP and it did not work. I got an error in inpa saying:

"Requested control unit: 'EKPM60_2,EKPM60_3' not found. Control unit found: 'EKP360'. Program will be stopped!"

Does that error message align with EKP needing to be programmed? Right now I'm just watching youtube videos and stuff trying to figure out what I need to do to code my EKP. I used inpa in the past, but that was really only to read codes back in the day before the cheaper tools could do it. This is the first time I've had to really use it so my learning curve is pretty big.

[dpaul]

Originally Posted by beardman

Thanks for the advice dpaul, I went ahead and ordered a new cable and installed inpa. I know I should have probably just done that in the first place. Now I'm going through the inpa learning curve again. I went over to my shop last night and plugged the computer in and was at least able to read some codes so I think I'm on track with my inpa install at least.

I read MSD80 error memory and it had :2F6C, 2AAF, and CD87.

I read the MSD80 info memory with environment and it had : 2FCA, 2FDA, and 2AD0.

For the heck of it I tried to connect to the EKP and it did not work. I got an error in inpa saying:

"Requested control unit: 'EKPM60_2,EKPM60_3' not found. Control unit found: 'EKP360'. Program will be stopped!"

Does that error message align with EKP needing to be programmed? Right now I'm just watching youtube videos and stuff trying to figure out what I need to do to code my EKP. I used inpa in the past, but that was really only to read codes back in the day before the cheaper tools could do it. This is the first time I've had to really use it so my learning curve is pretty big.

No, it means that your INPA setup is configured to expect EKP versions EKPM60_2 or EKP60M_3 but you have an EKPM360 installed.

Simple fix. You'll have to edit the E90.ENG file which will be in the INPA/CFGDAT directory. You can use any text editor like Notepad.

Under [ROOT_MOTOR] you'll find at least one entry mentioning EKPM, for example:

ENTRY=EKPM60_2, something,

'Something' can be any descriptive phrase, probably you'll find 'Fuel Pump EKP'. Anything after the first comma is just informational

Add this line:
ENTRY=EKP360, EKP360,

[Tawz123]

Got the same problem on a n43 320i e93 I'm baffled anyone figured this out??

[dpaul]

Originally Posted by beardman

I read MSD80 error memory and it had :2F6C, 2AAF, and CD87.

I read the MSD80 info memory with environment and it had : 2FCA, 2FDA, and 2AD0.

CD87 is a PT-CAN bus fault. That's going to stop your car from running.

Not sure what "info memory with enviroNment" and SFCA, 2FDA are not codes associated with the MSD80 DME AFAIK. However, 2AD0 is another CAN bus fault indicating that the DME is not receiving expected messages from the transmission. Again, that's going to stop your car.

I don't think you necessarily have a fuel pump issue. Something is interfering with the PT-CAN bus, either one of the components attached to it is bad or there's a broken wire or corroded connector.

[beardman]

Yikes, can bus fault is about the scariest thing I've heard in awhile.

I'm fixing this car though, if I have to learn how to diagnose a can bus system then I guess that's what I have to do. If I totally fail at that then I'll do what I know how to do and rip everything out and drop a small block chevy in it lol.

I think you are very right that whatever is going on is not limited to just the fuel side of things. Before I saw the last post, I hooked my lpfp to a jump pack so it would run. The car still would not start in that situation. So that rudimentary test leads me to believe there is something else going on just like you said.

Where would you start to diagnose the can bus system/are there any good resources I could start reading?

[dpaul]

Originally Posted by beardman

Yikes, can bus fault is about the scariest thing I've heard in awhile.

I'm fixing this car though, if I have to learn how to diagnose a can bus system then I guess that's what I have to do. If I totally fail at that then I'll do what I know how to do and rip everything out and drop a small block chevy in it lol.

I think you are very right that whatever is going on is not limited to just the fuel side of things. Before I saw the last post, I hooked my lpfp to a jump pack so it would run. The car still would not start in that situation. So that rudimentary test leads me to believe there is something else going on just like you said.

Where would you start to diagnose the can bus system/are there any good resources I could start reading?

These are difficult problems. But there are a few likely explanations: 1) a module is dead - probably not and certainly not the DME since you can read error msgs from it. 2) a module is flaky, perhaps putting some noise on the bus interfering but not eliminating communication 3) a wire is damaged or a connector is corroded.

The 1st thing I'd do would be to return to INPA. Don't read faults from just the DME, get them all: INPA->E90->Functional Jobs ->E90 -> Read Errors (F4). I'd erase all the fault codes, turn the car off and attempt to restart and see which errors come back. I'd do this a few times to make sure I was getting consistent results. Also get a list of modules using INPA (the above command path except ending in F2, I think). This is to make sure that all expected modules are actually present on the CAN bus.

The identity of the modules which are reporting errors will inform your next step.

I've attached a chapter from a BMW training document about the E90 electrical system. It's not going to give you diagnostic information but it will give you a good overview.

[Tawz123]

I'm guessing a faulty maf sensor with no codes can cause a crank no start ??

[dpaul]

Originally Posted by Tawz123

I'm guessing a faulty maf sensor with no codes can cause a crank no start ??

In fact, no. Most cars will not only start but some will run fairly well, for a while.


But it doesn’t matter in this case because the OPs car does not have a MAF (air flow) sensor. It has a MAP (pressure) sensor.

[Tawz123]

Originally Posted by dpaul

In fact, no. Most cars will not only start but some will run fairly well, for a while.


But it doesn’t matter in this case because the OPs car does not have a MAF (air flow) sensor. It has a MAP (pressure) sensor.

Would could cos a crank no start on a n43?

[dpaul]

Originally Posted by Tawz123

Would could cos a crank no start on a n43?

I don't know the answer to this but my guess would be a bad MAF will NOT cause a no-start. In fact I'd put some money on it. There are dozens of explanations for crank no start - why are you particularly interesting the MAF?

[Tawz123]

Originally Posted by dpaul

I don't know the answer to this but my guess would be a bad MAF will NOT cause a no-start. In fact I'd put some money on it. There are dozens of explanations for crank no start - why are you particularly interesting the MAF?

Cos I seen one e90 that had a faulty maf sensor which prevented
From starting.

[dpaul]

Originally Posted by Tawz123

Cos I seen one e90 that had a faulty maf sensor which prevented
From starting.

So do you have an N43 E90 that wont start? What codes to do read?

[Tawz123]

Originally Posted by dpaul

So do you have an N43 E90 that wont start? What codes to do read?

Yeah I do I posted a few months ago. I don't have any dme codes only had a 2d2a differential pressure sensor. Now it only Cranks but doesn't start.

[dpaul]

Originally Posted by Tawz123

Yeah I do I posted a few months ago. I don't have any dme codes only had a 2d2a differential pressure sensor. Now it only Cranks but doesn't start.

List all your codes, not just DME

[Tawz123]

Originally Posted by dpaul

List all your codes, not just DME

5e18 engine management interface
A559 instrument cluster power supply
A56f message incorrect emergency call receiver kombi
Cda6 fuel pump (disconnected the fuse when cranking)

[Tawz123]

@dpaul also when I disconnected the the injectors the rail pressure increased to the usually pressures

[dpaul]

Originally Posted by Tawz123

@dpaul also when I disconnected the the injectors the rail pressure increased to the usually pressures

Not sure I understand this statement.

Are you saying that your fuel rail pressure is low but when you disconnect the injector, the pressure increases?

What are the pressure values with injectors connected and disconnected?

EDIT: I looked at your previous thread. Sound like your injectors were very leaky, apparently as common a problem with the N43 as the N54. Have you replaced them?