[xtougher]

Originally Posted by M2siast

Never even been in one.
No manual, no care.

But if it had a manual, when it launched, it would have been incredible based on reviews and my own views:

- awesome sound (much better than F8X)
- incredible power
- practical
- awesome handling
- beautiful styling
- unique
- quirky
- cheaper than an F80

All things I look for.
I could do with the lack of reliability and poor service (I guess I’d stop taking it in and just do work on my own).

Yeah, I actually never looked seriously at it for the same reason: no manual option.

But could have thought about it a bit for those other reasons, possibly, back in the day!

I actually have yet to be able to hear it in person, just on quick videos when it first got released years ago.

[M2PDX]

Originally Posted by Ravenseal

The carbon roof saves 50lbs over the sunroof, which is the only other option in the US. Other markets have the option for a steel roof, which is closer to 15lbs in savings. Manual gearbox also saves another 30-40lbs in weight. Throw on some lighter wheels, swap out the midpipe, etc, etc., and a manual G87 can be 100-150 lbs lighter than a stock automatic with the sunroof. It's been conversed on this forum extensively, and JackiePhD Racing on youtube has done a ton of weight cutting on his car as proof.

All of which I've done, PLUS a lithium battery ... 38 lb. savings!

[gnx]

Originally Posted by M2siast

Alfa Romeo made the fatal mistake of not bringing the manual transmission to North America. DOA.
I’d be driving one today and would probably have skipped the M2…

Well, they phased out the manual by the end of calendar 2017. The had only produced 15 manual cars that year...

[Montaver]

If you want to add steering feel get a set of bimmerworld monoball thrust arm bushings.

How do you feel it compares to the Supra? Both the Supra and G87 are cars I’m considering buying at the moment, it wil be 90pc track.

[abrandonment]

Originally Posted by JABCAT

I'm curious for those that think the steering is numb or the vehicle is not engaging to drive, what are you expecting it to feel like? We're talking street driving correct, not track driving

The M2 feels like driving a sim. A car has output from the road, track or street and in every car I've owned before you feel that output, and the act of driving is you responding with your own input.

The M2 (in comfort) feels to me like the output from the road has been captured, processed and artificially recreated before being delivered to me as the driver.

That is the best way I can describe it.

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by xtougher

I resonate with this some (although I can't relate because I don't have a 1 of 3 car!).

I do agree and feel that the cars I have driven have felt different from each other. And I have preferences as well.

But I don't see myself thinking the G87's steering is "terrible" or completely absent of feel.

Also, I'm personally not looking for a go kart level of steering feel, since I'm daily driving this for a while.

I think it's fine, and in fact, feels better than my previous car (340i).

My most recent DD before the M2 was a '22 330e MSport. I purchased it having not driven a new BMW in probably 20 years. Drove the 330e 31k mi in 17 months & thought it was a great car. My wife picked up the X3MC last August & I couldn't let her be the only one with a 500 hp DD, so started looking at gently used M3/4s. She actually sent me a pic of a new M2 in the showroom when she was looking at the X3. I didn't initially like it, but started looking at more pics online. Saw it had the same performance as the 3/4 for much less $$ & brand new.

Found one in the color & spec I wanted about 50 mi away & purchased it without having driven it. Figured if it was as good as my 330e but with more power I'd be happy. Obviously it completely surpasses the 330e in every category & I'm very happy with my decision all around. As long as it stays reliable, I'll keep it around & it'll go to my son when he graduates college in a few years (he gets the Z when I'm dust )

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by abrandonment

The M2 feels like driving a sim. A car has output from the road, track or street and in every car I've owned before you feel that output, and the act of driving is you responding with your own input.

The M2 (in comfort) feels to me like the output from the road has been captured, processed and artificially recreated before being delivered to me as the driver.

That is the best way I can describe it.

I guess I understand that. The only time I drive in comfort is the last two miles of my commute because the roads are like driving through a mine field. Even then, the only setting that is on comfort is chasis which helps absorb the rough road. The rest of the time it's in sport which I feel provides plenty of feedback.

[abrandonment]

I have to stop opining on all of it until this weekend when I get back to the car for more than a dozen miles of seat time.

Have you spent time in a Porsche? For me, they feel like the road outputs are passed directly from pavement to your brain, no processing, no filtered recreation.. raw feeling without being harsh.

[iifymbro]

Originally Posted by abrandonment

The M2 feels like driving a sim. A car has output from the road, track or street and in every car I've owned before you feel that output, and the act of driving is you responding with your own input.

The M2 (in comfort) feels to me like the output from the road has been captured, processed and artificially recreated before being delivered to me as the driver.

That is the best way I can describe it.

definitely don't use comfort mode, think I used it twice in my m340i cause the steering was so light and numb. Setup a sport individual/M individual mode with a combo of settings that feel good and just flip it into that mode on startup every time.

Good every day combo in BMWs is usually steering in sportiest setting (or one back from 'most sporty' if it's way too heavy), suspension in comfort, engine/throttle one back from 'most sporty' cause it's too high strung early in the pedal travel, gearbox in the middle so it's not lazy but also not acting like you're on a track every time you brake/accelerate lol

[DrewNewM2]

I switch back and forth between the g87 and my modified 450 whp 2020 STi and the hydraulic steering, short shifter, short gearing, stiff sway bars and coilovers make the STi feel way more connected than the M2, especially around town. STi has more lag on aftermarket single turbo but when shit hits, it’s hard. M2 definitely has more of an isolated feeling, very quiet, long shifter throws, excellent ride quality, high potential S58 and will shine at triple digits on big tracks, autobahn. I had intended to sell the STi when the M2 came but hard to get rid of and I like them both for what they are. M2 is not numb, it’s just high tech and really refined. I feel the manual transmission helps . I have a manual Bronco as well so engagement is important to me. Save the manuals!

[JABCAT]

Originally Posted by abrandonment

I have to stop opining on all of it until this weekend when I get back to the car for more than a dozen miles of seat time.

Have you spent time in a Porsche? For me, they feel like the road outputs are passed directly from pavement to your brain, no processing, no filtered recreation.. raw feeling without being harsh.

I have, and my Z06 is very Porsche-like. It's 3200 lb, carbon fiber body components (fenders, top) hard top, manual, no real insulation from road noise, and is set up for track use. It has magnetic ride adjustable suspension which I've had re-programmed by the great Jim Mero (look him up if unfamiliar) to be more aggressive in its sport mode.

So that being said, while the g87 isn't to the level of my Z06, I still don't find it "numb" or not engaging/devoid of feedback. We have to keep in mind that current vehicles, regardless of what they are, have a lot more "stuff" in them than previous generations. They have different systems that inherently disconnect the driver from the car. All these drive "modes" are programmed software, whether we like it or not.

I love the relative simplicity and rawness of my Z06 without all the comfort & "safety" features of the M2, but I would never daily my Z06. I took it on a 1,500 mi round trip last summer & while very exciting to drive and very engaging, I was beat up after each leg (750 mi) of the trip. I drive my M2 500 mi round trip every weekend, and it's a great drive. I'm not exhausted like I am from the constant driver inputs needed in my Z06. The M2, imo, combines the power, handling, driver experience with comfort better than much out there.

[JMcLellan]

Originally Posted by abrandonment

I have to stop opining on all of it until this weekend when I get back to the car for more than a dozen miles of seat time.

Have you spent time in a Porsche? For me, they feel like the road outputs are passed directly from pavement to your brain, no processing, no filtered recreation.. raw feeling without being harsh.

I know what you mean. I was able to drive a GT3 RS on a track a couple years ago in Vegas and the feeling of driving that car was insane. Nothing else I have ever driven comes close to comparing to it. I'm heading back to that track in May and planning to try out a GT2 RS. I will forever be ruined.

[DSTR]

Originally Posted by JMcLellan

I know what you mean. I was able to drive a GT3 RS on a track a couple years ago in Vegas and the feeling of driving that car was insane. Nothing else I have ever driven comes close to comparing to it. I'm heading back to that track in May and planning to try out a GT2 RS. I will forever be ruined.

GT3/RS and 2RS are what we all want in a car - until we hit traffic and need comfort lol. For performance driving they are the standard. Ruining is a good idea. We live once, so LIVE! Sounds fun!

[Good 4 2 reasons]

Originally Posted by abrandonment

I have to stop opining on all of it until this weekend when I get back to the car for more than a dozen miles of seat time.

Have you spent time in a Porsche? For me, they feel like the road outputs are passed directly from pavement to your brain, no processing, no filtered recreation.. raw feeling without being harsh.

I test drove a Cayman and can absolutely agree with this sentiment. I got tired of hunting for a lightly used one that didn't have 5 owners at 30k miles, swirl marks all over the paint, and a few options I actually cared about (manual, sport chrono, and PASM).

Buying a new 718 is a joke. The options pricing is absurd. My local dealer wanted 18% over MSRP in added options to get an April allocation for a 718 Cayman S. I know you don't buy a 718 for the infotainment experience, but the age of the infotainment is pitiful considering a "well optioned" 718 S can easily climb to 100k.

If I could get a new 718 base for 65k without the games, I would have gone with one for the pure driving experience, because it really drives and handles like an extension of the driver. The shopping experience (new and used), turned me away from ultimately buying one.

This would have been a once or twice a week driving car, I daily my X5 diesel to work and back. I will be happy with M2, one of the last gasser manual sports cars with modern conveniences, and a full 4 year warranty.

[BroDoze]

I’ve had cars (STIs, 135s etc) I’ve modified to the point where I could barely stand them for more than 15-30 minutes at a time in traffic and crappy roads and long drives. I told myself I wouldn’t do that again. I think it’s a trade off like everything. In my 20s I was all about it. In my 40s, I need a little comfort, lol. Which I realize sacrifices some raw go-kartness.

[toprarnen]

Originally Posted by BroDoze

...I need a little comfort, lol. Which I realize sacrifices some raw go-kartness.

I used to live near a really nice outdoor karting track that scratched that truly "raw" itch. Getting back into my car ('06 IS350) after a 30-lap race was a relief!

[abrandonment]

I guess my earlier points was that there are cars that don't exist on the extreme end (street legal go-karts) that haven't lost the connected-to-the-surface-beneath-you feel.

None of them (I know of) check the boxes I need checked but there are shades of gray, trade-offs, etc. I'm hopeful that tinkering with settings, or remapping may get me closer to what I am missing with the M2 because other than the artificial steering feel it checks just about every box.

[toprarnen]

Originally Posted by abrandonment

I'm hopeful that tinkering with settings, or remapping may get me closer to what I am missing with the M2 because other than the artificial steering feel it checks just about every box.

Same, but additionally with shifter feel and clutch feel too.

Type R or Porsche shifter/clutch feel and steering, everything else M2. Sounds like the perfect car to me.

So I'm looking at the typical clutch improvements (clutch stop, potentially clutch replacement), steering (software update for CSL if reversible, dinan tension strut ball joint replacement if that doesn't solve it), and maybe an SSK if it comes to it. Saying all this, I'll probably just put in the clutch stop and drive it stock for a while. $70k is a lot to pay for a car before doing all these things to it.

[ghaffari46]

I always drive it in sport. I think they put efficient settings there to meet regulations .
Efficient settings is not for people in this forum!

[Carefree]

Originally Posted by ghaffari46

Efficient settings is not for people in this forum!

Dumb post of the day.

[Carefree]

Originally Posted by ghaffari46

Well, that response shows your high intelligence and respect for others my friend.

Thank you.

[ghaffari46]

Originally Posted by Carefree

Thank you.

Good progress. You can thank people