[gangzoom]

Originally Posted by ade555

I'm more then understanding, mistakes do happen on job, but this is silly mistake and cost cutting on his part, jobs wasn't cheap but I think he got to gready is my honest opinion.

I hope you get it sorted, but it doesn't sound like this guy really knows what his doing sadly .

Good trades do exist but are hard to find, that's why I honestly don't care about the ££££ on our build, because all the guys we've had so far have been fantastic (touching wood).

The kitchen fitters were back out today, as it turned out they had fitted the wrong sink, we only realised last week after my wife went through the orignal quite. One email, and they apologised for getting it wrong, new work top and sink fitted yesterday, zero mention about cost. They also measured one of the cabinets so wrong so coming back again to reinstall once the right cabinet is made.

Good luck with sorting out the roof!!

[ade555]

Originally Posted by Pond

That picture shows strand board. You really don't want that near a roof unless it is perfectly sealed from water ingress.

I found this picture when I was looking at EDPM flat bay roofs, so you do have one piece going over it with elevated tiles over top of it. From what I seen it tiles can't touch EDPM as is rubber, I'm sort trying to find a solution my self been honest, failing all that is matter of getting someone else pay him then try to recover money from original roofer. As I'm not a roofer I could be wrong but where the felt goes from sloped to flat it needs to be one piece not torched patches as you risking join to fail.

[ade555]

Originally Posted by gangzoom

I hope you get it sorted, but it doesn't sound like this guy really knows what his doing sadly .

Good trades do exist but are hard to find, that's why I honestly don't care about the ££££ on our build, because all the guys we've had so far have been fantastic (touching wood).

The kitchen fitters were back out today, as it turned out they had fitted the wrong sink, we only realised last week after my wife went through the orignal quite. One email, and they apologised for getting it wrong, new work top and sink fitted yesterday, zero mention about cost. They also measured one of the cabinets so wrong so coming back again to reinstall once the right cabinet is made.

Good luck with sorting out the roof!!

Honestly if I knew someone local I would have gone with someone else unfortunately is a trade that just can't find decent recommendation, spoken to my plumber and electrician even if they can recommend someone. People I used and know they doing top job and even they said good luck. It does look like he just hasn't got a clue how to sort this mess. Only was doing the flat bay roof as it had 100year old lead on it with crack patched.

£2400 for new facia around property, chimney flashing and flat roof on bay window, so is not cheap is not like he wanted couple hundred quids or something. All the work I wanted doing been maintenance on property, didn't want problems once bedroom gets renovated, no leaks or anything but previous owner has bodged up facias and looked crap. Thank God I just didn't ask him to put new roof on, I would have been absolutely fubard.

Sink looks much better by the way.

[NotGotABimmer23]

The whole shape looks odd to me, that valley is going to constantly pool water isn't it which will then run under the join or off to the sides.

[ade555]

Originally Posted by NotGotABimmer23

The whole shape looks odd to me, that valley is going to constantly pool water isn't it which will then run under the join or off to the sides.

Yeap, that's what looks to me when he lifted tiles up. There should be back board piece going up as at the moment you only have single osb board which is to short and that creates that channel. When I inspected the job first time tiles was in place so wasn't any wiser and on face of it looked fine. I did question no slope towards the front like next door house, but was assured will just run to side and next door has GRP.

[ade555]

Well he turned up like he said but no materials 🤬, conversation went along the lines:

Where is you materials?
All roofing merchants are closed

Why didn't you get materials yesterday?
I was on a job which didn't finish late

So you was fixing another fuck up or ripping someone else off?
No reply

So what now?
Well I can do temp fix using waterproof coating ect.

So when you going to fix this properly?
Tuesday

Not good enough plus I'm at work so you not getting on that roof till I'm free as I have to stand there and watch every single thing you do.

So conversation turned in to I had to let him on it to put that stuff on try stop the leak. The min he lifted tiles up you could see where water was pooling up then leaking on yet again failed joint which he should have fixed it first time.

I told him straight that I will have a discussion with wife if we even want him to put this right as lost all trust specially when it comes to him actually fixing this or even if he has ability to torch felt.

Every single joint I checked is pealing back and you don't have to put much force or pressure. Felt just not done properly or he used shit felt.


I asked him his insurance details and my heart just sunked, he hasn't got one, he's saying he is willing to pay for another roofing company to fix this but I'm guessing I will be meeting him in court to get my money back.

Or

Allow him to get there on Thursday and try to sort it, been honest I have a feeling he won't be able to and I will be back to same problem or he will just give me the run around again, saying will be here in morning then not turning up till later.

Also noticed another things which I showed him, like front gutter corners have no seals in them so water leaks, asked him where the seals gone, just stayed quite. Says on invoice gutter renew, same thing I noticed there is gaps on facias ect. Is just bodged up, most of it once you start to inspect it.


Think will have to get some legal advice as I'm not taking the financial hit on that. On plus side I chucked about 100L of water and no leaks after he smeared the bitumen on it as a temp fix.

[ade555]

You can see water just sits there, and if is running to side honestly is very minimal,it don't run to front, so will take forever to drain or you have to wait to evaporate.

[NotGotABimmer23]

Originally Posted by ade555

You can see water just sits there, and if is running to side honestly is very minimal,it don't run to front, so will take forever to drain or you have to wait to evaporate.

Yeah that's a complete mess. You can't have pooling on a roof, it needs to be sloped correctly or it is guaranteed to leak. It's a complete bodge ATM but this guy isn't going to sort it.

I don't know a lot about felt, but if that was lead all the joins would be stepped to prevent water going back up the joins. Rubber would be easier though and could all be done in a single piece.

[Watsey]

This screams “rank amateur”.

Separate pieces of felt, felt not torched, OSB rather than waterproof ply (“WBP” at least), at least two significant leaks.

In my mind the guy was dodgy from the start, i.e. your first conversation. You paid him for materials and scaffolding, now it’s really only his labour charge at risk. Seems like he’s either incompetent, or trying to make a few Quid extra by doing a quick bodge.

Good luck but also remember the age-old saying “buy cheap, buy twice”.

[saltyamigo]

Work appears extremely poor and no insurance says a lot about the way he's looking to run a business. You should not be the one looking for solutions, that's why you hire a tradesman in the first place, they should know how to do the required job properly. This is never going to end well, and regardless of what he does now you will have no confidence that the job will last a long time, which it should if done correctly. Better off trying to sort this out now, he may get lucky and bodge it up enough to last a few months or more, but where will he be by that time if it all goes wrong, which going by his efforts so far it's not an unlikely scenario. If that's the standard of his work I doubt he'll be in business for long.

[Scoobyd]

This has been a disaster from the very start. Really hope you get it sorted but lessons to be learned here. Quality of service/work is so hit and miss these days, mostly miss, that you need to really do your research before committing to someone. Look for reviews, preferably get a referral from others, try and speak to other people they’ve done work for, check insurance etc before starting the job.

The saying ‘if you think it’s expensive to hire a professional, wait until you hire an amateur’ has rarely been more true. And the cost here isn’t just monetary. It’s the stress, upset, and hassle it’s causing you too.

[ade555]

All valid points and will take it on board.

Yes lost confidence of him actually redoing the work to satisfactory standard, I questioned the slope ect. and all looks like bodge job from my view on this.

Getting someone else they will want to redo all the work, won't matter if is good roofer or bad one, I'm sure everyone will want doing there way. Which is not a problem.

Someone mention I paid for materials ect., well I didn't sort of thing, I offered it but was told that he already paid for it ect so we agreed to stage payment, when he arrived it was £1000 this covered materials, then £400 for scaffold and £1000 once job was completed. When looked at it looked fine so paid, everything looked okish till start raining and from the picture below you wouldn't be able to tell is bodged, only thing that I seen was felt not in one piece but due to roll size is just possible.


I do have finances to get someone else to redo the work but won't lie it will mess with rest of the work I need to get done. Then hope I will see penny from him.

[gac]

My brother has recently been going through a similar process with his windows - I forget exactly what the problems were but it's resulted in a very long court process, involving removing one set of brand new windows and having a new set fitted at his expense in order to return the old-new set to get a court-ordered refund. Or something along those lines, it's been rumbling on for months with numerous opportunities to come and make good, as you have also offered.

Honestly, if you can, I would get it fixed as properly as you are able to on your own dime and then worry about taking this chap to small claims or something separately (if you're under the small claims limit) because repairing the damage to the roof can't exactly be contingent on you getting the money back and you have documented adequate of allowing the first guy the chance to repair (even if it's only this thread). Seems to me like the most important thing is to get the house watertight and if that has to come out of your pocket temporarily then that sucks but your hand has been forced by the situation.

I get wanting a good price and wanting to give someone a chance, I've hired people who were just starting out as well to do stuff I can't do (and can't reasonably assess their skill at, I wouldn't even know how to evaluate someone else's work in the same level of detail as you have, let alone suggest fixes or try do DIY it) but I've so far been lucky or picky enough to only get people who do have insurance in case of the worst happening.

[ade555]

I have been reading up a bit about consumer rights act ect.

So it says that tradesman should use reasonable care and skill must be used. It doesn't look like he demonstrated the above.
I am entitled to repair or refund, I don't think repair would last or he has ability to fix it so is out of question. Refund only option in my eyes then try to get someone.

Can anyone advice on the above?

[gangzoom]

Originally Posted by ade555

Someone mention I paid for materials ect., well I didn't sort of thing, I offered it but was told that he already paid for it ect so we agreed to stage payment, when he arrived it was £1000 this covered materials, then £400 for scaffold and £1000 once job was completed. ,,

I know nothing about building but our builder quoted £5000 to strip/recover our garage roof which I estimate is about 8-10 times the area of what you have shown in the photo. From my conversation with our builder I'm pretty sure he said for that cost they wouldn't be using felt as such but a newer material that's the same type as what's used on the new flat roof our builder has alrady installed on the house.

£2400 for reroofing that area in the photos looks pretty punchy, at the very least it should be done properly with the most mordern flat roof material which 100% isn't flet anymore. For that amount paid and area, shouldn't they be stripping the old felt off, putting down a new board underneath to ensure no pooling, and than recover the board?

[ade555]

Originally Posted by gangzoom

I know nothing about building but our builder quoted £5000 to strip/recover our garage roof which I estimate is about 8-10 times the area of what you have shown in the photo. From my conversation with our builder I'm pretty sure he said for that cost they wouldn't be using felt as such but a newer material that's the same type as what's used on the new flat roof our builder has alrady installed on the house.

£2400 for reroofing that area in the photos looks pretty punchy, at the very least it should be done properly with the most mordern flat roof material which 100% isn't flet anymore. For that amount paid and area, shouldn't they be stripping the old felt off, putting down a new board underneath to ensure no pooling, and than recover the board?

Ah the price of £2400 was for renew guttering, which hasn't been done, used old gutters along with fittings, repoint all ridges/ hips as if went with dry ridge system most likely would have needed new roof so job looked right, there was alway big risk when removing old morter from ridges it would damage tiles. New facias all around, chimney flashing which I agread to use newer materials like leadR or whatever is called and put new roof above bay window.

Reason why I wanted to get this done was in poor state and before I started to strip bedroom back to bricks I wanted to make sure I won't have problems once upstairs gets done in year time or something like. Flat bay still had old lead on it but didn't leaked.

I am worried about the state of timber under that felt now. Talking to roofer yesterday I'm already getting a feeling he won't remove felt or the board underneath ect., as conversation always turns to just fix the leak along the back blah blah blah.
There was substantial amount of water leaking first time round.

Even I am entitled to money back as he failed twice now to attempt repair this it won't be straight forward job as just getting money back and getting someone else.

[NotGotABimmer23]

You want epdm, fibreglass or lead. Felt is for sheds. Looks like EPDM above which is really the go to now for a flat roof. It's cheap, a single piece so won't have joins to leak and it's easy to apply, just glues down to some osb.

[ade555]

Couldn't get much done over bank holidays but listen to advice from here and went to local roofing merchant and asked if they can recommend someone, been given number they said his been doing for years, and everytime they hand his number out customer coming back to thank them.

Anyway spoken to him this morning explained and sent all photos across, reply I got so far "what a mess"

He is doing job not far from me and should be able to pop in later today to tomorrow to take a look.

Now apart from getting number from proper roofing merchant and will ask him if he has liability insurance what else would you recommend? Only think I can think of is asking him for jobs his done and go and ask the customer directly

[Pond]

Originally Posted by ade555

Now apart from getting number from proper roofing merchant and will ask him if he has liability insurance what else would you recommend? Only think I can think of is asking him for jobs his done and go and ask the customer directly

He has been recommended by a trade supplier who obviously deal with him a lot which is a good thing. Means he buys 'proper' materials from a 'proper' supplier, not Screwfix or B&Q.

Listen to what he says when he turns up to survey. You know a lot more now than you did before, so his attitude should tell you whether he is any good TBH.

There are no cast iron guarantees no matter how many people you talk to, but the good tradesmen are out there, hardest part is finding them.

Let us know how you get on!

[ade555]

I'm trying to get some advice if someone can help regards refund.

I message original roofer couple days ago that work will be assessed ect. and will let him know of our decision if we will let him carry out the repairs or we get someone else. We'll let's just say we are getting someone else.

He messaged my back saying that he agrees what I listed in terms of what needs correcting and if we wish full refund can be arranged.

I don't trust one bit what he said and asked him to clarify full refund, as not sure if he is talking all money or minus materials, if he is talking minus materials can I ask him for proof of receipt for the materials? Again skeptical what he actually bought, apart from couple bags of ready mixed bedding mortar, couple boxes of eveas trays not sure if the rest of material was new or he just used from company he subs out to. So just trying to arm my self with info ect.

[ade555]

And the fun begins, from text saying full refund to I'm happy to refund you 100% for this, 25% for that, 25% for that ect.

Hold on a min on invoice the jobs are listed but not priced individually so 100% of what sum ect. I be glad to see the back of this guy been honest.

[Watsey]

It’s very simple. The entire job was not performed correctly, and will need to be (in all likelihood) 100% stripped back and done again.

The materials can’t be re-used.
New materials will have to be supplied.
More scaffolding will have to be erected.
More labour will be required.

100% refund of all monies paid to him.

If he refuses, make it a legal matter.