[mistryn]

one of the swirl flaps have started to weep oil around the orange gasket - I enquired at BMW who said a whole new manifold is required as they dont sell the gaskets on their own.

Checked on realoem and managed to find the part number -
11617790198
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...=11&fg=40&hl=6
no 2


reading through various posts some members have just re sealed the original gaskets with silicone rather than replacing them.

what is the general view should I just buy 6x new ones or get the garage to replace?

[tmarshall57]

That part isn't the swirl flap gasket. It is a gasket which seals the manifold port to the inlet port. There are 2 types of these and either 4 or 6 of each are fitted depending on whether the engine is 4 or 6 cylinder. You shouldn't need to buy new ones, they can normally be reused. You should remove the swirl flap cartridges, clean them up and seal with Tiger Seal. You cannot buy the swirl flaps separately.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/U-Pol-Adhesi.../dp/B004QDPVZ6

Don't use sealant on the gaskets for which you quoted the part number

[old grey steve]

If you're pulling the manifold off do yourself one favour remove the swirl flaps and replace them with the well documented blanks. Here's one lucky owner we encountered very recently

[URL=http://s33.photobucket.com/user/SB330D/media/Forum/imagejpg3_zpsaa9fd71c.jpg.html][/URL

5 swirl flaps looking tied but in tact. Here's the sixth



Notice the flaps missing well it was broken clean away only the crud and shit was keeping it from being ingested



We seen countless engines written off by this issue. It's a cheap fix in the real scheme of things and a must for the diesel owner. Yes, BMW have modified them but they are still vulnerable

[mistryn]

thanks tmarshall57 for the info, I always thought the orange gaskets were part of the swirl flaps and di not realise this was to seal the manifold to the inlet

so these can be just cleaned up and re-used?

steve - i have not really ever thought about using the blanking plates as I thought the later designs were more robust?
Steve - do you have any reccomendations where to get the blanking plates from?
am I right in thinking if I use blanking plates then I dont have to buy additional sealent?
will blanking the swirl flaps prevent oil leakage around the manifold?

[tmarshall57]

Those photos look like older swirl flaps. Those on the e90 were modded to prevent the ingestion issue. They also have an orange rubber coating. Some have blanked the flaps as Steve says and had no issues. Some have noted loss of torque at low RPM. The flaps are there for a reason. Yes - the orange gaskets can be reused unless they are obviously unusable - unusual.

[jwilliams]

Can we please know the dealer that tells you no gaskets exist please.

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by tmarshall57

Those photos look like older swirl flaps. Those on the e90 were modded to prevent the ingestion issue. They also have an orange rubber coating. Some have blanked the flaps as Steve says and had no issues. Some have noted loss of torque at low RPM. The flaps are there for a reason. Yes - the orange gaskets can be reused unless they are obviously unusable - unusual.

+1

Old swirl flap


Notice that there is screw and thats where the problem is and it breaks....

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgur...tart=0&ndsp=15

or whole axis breaks


I believe new ones are without those screws and made of plastic (correct me if i am wrong)

Nit, I would still use the tiger seal if I'd go for blanking plates.

[Ajs_435d]

I've fitted blanking plates and dynod after no decremental effect on performance could have even improved performance but was leaking at the time.

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by old grey steve

If you're pulling the manifold off do yourself one favour remove the swirl flaps and replace them with the well documented blanks. Here's one lucky owner we encountered very recently

5 swirl flaps looking tied but in tact. Here's the sixth


Notice the flaps missing well it was broken clean away only the crud and shit was keeping it from being ingested
We seen countless engines written off by this issue. It's a cheap fix in the real scheme of things and a must for the diesel owner. Yes, BMW have modified them but they are still vulnerable

Steve
Do you mind sharing the production date of that car?
Am I correct in thinking that later 330Ds have different swirl flaps which are not prone to fail. Mine is early 2008.

Thanks

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by ajs_335d

I've fitted blanking plates and dynod after no decremental effect on performance could have even improved performance but was leaking at the time.

What year is your car mate?

[Ajs_435d]

Late 2007 335d

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by ajs_335d

Late 2007 335d

Thanks mate. Have you had the similar swirl flaps as shown in the photos?

I read that at some stage bmw changed the design and there were no more screws and metallic plates as shown in the photo, but cannot remember when exactly they did it.

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by makkan00

Steve
Do you mind sharing the production date of that car?
Am I correct in thinking that later 330Ds have different swirl flaps which are not prone to faile. Mine is early 2008.

Thanks

From memory it was an 05/05 vehicle we had in the space of 4 days 5 vehicles in they had various issues such as glow plugs, pressure converters etc. and when noted and customers were allowed to see(internet)what all the fuss was about all felt it's was better safe than sorry or in my words prevent ions better than cure, so we basically done 5 swirl flap blank replacements.

Considering that when the glows are being fine the manifolds off anyway it's a no brainer considering their past historic performance.

But re the design of the actual flap, from my recollection I've seen the pictured design then the later as I call it the "encapsulated design" plus I seem to recollect that the later units say from 2007/08 cars have also been tweaked. So what does that tell you..

Thing is while the manifolds off and when you look at the crud that builds up in the area concerned would you chose to pass the opportunity by to remove the risk?

Next time I get a later car in ill take a picture or 2!

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by old grey steve

From memory it was an 05/05 vehicle we had in the space of 4 days 5 vehicles in they had various issues such as glow plugs, pressure converters etc. and when noted and customers were allowed to see(internet)what all the fuss was about all felt it's was better safe than sorry or in my words prevent ions better than cure, so we basically done 5 swirl flap blank replacements.

Considering that when the glows are being fine the manifolds off anyway it's a no brainer considering their past historic performance.

But re the design of the actual flap, from my recollection I've seen the pictured design then the later as I call it the "encapsulated design" plus I seem to recollect that the later units say from 2007/08 cars have also been tweaked. So what does that tell you..

Thing is while the manifolds off and when you look at the crud that builds up in the area concerned would you chose to pass the opportunity by to remove the risk?

Next time I get a later car in ill take a picture or 2!

Thanks. Will appreciate if you can take a snap of late 2007 or early 2008.
I have early 2008 and I am hopeful that I will have new trouble free design.

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by makkan00

Thanks. Will appreciate if you can take a snap of late 2007 or early 2008.
I have early 2008 and I am hopeful that I will have new trouble free design.

Your swirl flap design is different to those photographed as pointed out elsewhere, thing is as I've said longevity wise you trust them to last and stay functional and intact.

[Ajs_435d]

Originally Posted by makkan00

Thanks mate. Have you had the similar swirl flaps as shown in the photos?

I read that at some stage bmw changed the design and there were no more screws and metallic plates as shown in the photo, but cannot remember when exactly they did it.

New ones in your above post, mine had orange rubber seals that had oil on thus weeping and suspect leaking boost as my car was down on power even with dpf delete and remap at circa 350BHP, after this it added over 20BHP and torque

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by ajs_335d

New ones in your above post, mine had orange rubber seals that had oil on thus weeping and suspect leaking boost as my car was down on power even with dpf delete and remap at circa 350BHP, after this it added over 20BHP and torque

Sorry which one are new one.
Afaik, I posted the photos of old ones.

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by makkan00

Thanks. Will appreciate if you can take a snap of late 2007 or early 2008.
I have early 2008 and I am hopeful that I will have new trouble free design.

Here you go as promissed as I knew it wouldn't take long. Not a 330d but a 335d 08/08 68900 miles but you get the picture











General look wise you can see the obvious oil leakage but the seals seem on tese to be fairly robust(unlike the rubber seals on the 335i's that seem to flake away)

But to Makk's main question re the design....











Trust me if you manifolds coming off get rid of them thoug hstronger than the earlier ones these aren't immune I feel







These were gunked up and stank as you'd expect were oily too what of course you won't see is their action they were not smooth at all. If you look at the flap design



you'll see 2 what appears to be rivits that go through the shaft/flap and when wiggled as I did they all had movement(though they feel more robust than the first generation flaps and are noticably thicker) and if you look carefully at the modified flap[ casing that BMW have chosen to install casing as we always do



you'll notice its started to break or crumble away. Hope this helps re the debate. Manifold out and get em gone For diesels its better safe'n'sorry

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by old grey steve

Here you go as promissed as I knew it wouldn't take long. Not a 330d but a 335d 08/08 68900 miles but you get the picture

General look wise you can see the obvious oil leakage but the seals seem on tese to be fairly robust(unlike the rubber seals on the 335i's that seem to flake away)

But to Makk's main question re the design....


Trust me if you manifolds coming off get rid of them thoug hstronger than the earlier ones these aren't immune I feel



These were gunked up and stank as you'd expect were oily too what of course you won't see is their action they were not smooth at all. If you look at the flap design

you'll see 2 what appears to be rivits that go through the shaft/flap and when wiggled as I did they all had movement(though they feel more robust than the first generation flaps and are noticably thicker) and if you look carefully at the modified flap[ casing that BMW have chosen to install casing as we always do


you'll notice its started to break or crumble away. Hope this helps re the debate. Manifold out and get em gone For diesels its better safe'n'sorry

Many thanks for taking time and showing us this.
So technically, a stronger flap is not going to help. There are still 2 screws and rivet can break at any time. And I cannot understand what casing will do around the flap? Is it intended to stop the flap dislodging? or what?

Now considering it is still a risk, have you changed these to blanking plates on 08 car and if yes, are they any adverse effects on performance especially at lower rpms?

Thanks.

[old grey steve]

Originally Posted by makkan00

Many thanks for taking time and showing us this.
So technically, a stronger flap is not going to help. There are still 2 screws and rivet can break at any time. And I cannot understand what casing will do around the flap? Is it intended to stop the flap dislodging? or what?

Now considering it is still a risk, have you changed these to blanking plates on 08 car and if yes, are they any adverse effects on performance especially at lower rpms?

Thanks.

Every car where we take the manifold off the things are taken off and replaced with blanks.

The pics you see above as stated were from an 08/08 335d, so the same design as yours, I'll clean one up tomorrow get rid of all the oil muck and take another photo of the flap and will take a photo side by side with a 1st genration flap.

The quality is better for sure the flaps are thicker to the touch but issues are still in place

I've tried to enhance this photo slightly to show the rivit's as I'd call them (circled) that are placed in the flap



If you look closely at the pic below of a side view of a flap I've circled what I'd describe again as a rivit on the flap I'd noticed this had some play and you can see the rivit is sitting proud



I've not had a car in equipped with a late flap design dropping through thing is eventually though stronger are these going to go the same way. If so and one of these flaps let go the damage I feel will be more severe than the earlier one's. The casings suppost to be there to assist, if you look at the bottow pic you'll notice the casing has started to break up



All I'd say is they leak though no one to my knowledge has reported them failing yetwould you take the risk for the small out lay.

[Murphyslaw]

Yeah I honestly think that will be added to my to do list! Mines an 07 so hopefully got the new swirl flaps. I need the EGR pressure converter replacing so would be silly not to get these done at the same time. Shame you are 2 hours away from me Steve!

[makkan00]

Originally Posted by old grey steve

Every car where we take the manifold off the things are taken off and replaced with blanks.

The pics you see above as stated were from an 08/08 335d, so the same design as yours, I'll clean one up tomorrow get rid of all the oil muck and take another photo of the flap and will take a photo side by side with a 1st genration flap.

The quality is better for sure the flaps are thicker to the touch but issues are still in place

I've tried to enhance this photo slightly to show the rivit's as I'd call them (circled) that are placed in the flap

If you look closely at the pic below of a side view of a flap I've circled what I'd describe again as a rivit on the flap I'd noticed this had some play and you can see the rivit is sitting proud


I've not had a car in equipped with a late flap design dropping through thing is eventually though stronger are these going to go the same way. If so and one of these flaps let go the damage I feel will be more severe than the earlier one's. The casings suppost to be there to assist, if you look at the bottow pic you'll notice the casing has started to break up


All I'd say is they leak though no one to my knowledge has reported them failing yetwould you take the risk for the small out lay.

That make sense now. I though rivit was the axis around which the flap spins but after your explanation, it all make sense.

Looking forward to see the photos of clean part.

B/w does any body know which size blanking plates fit in 330d/335d?
33mm or 22mm?
And has anybody cleaned manifold and if yes, what have you used to get the gunk / soot out?