[hl0m4n]

what are your thoughts on a 2010 997.2 tt as a daily driver? 2011 is model year where they did the lci in addition to pdk and new 3.8l engine.

my thoughts are:

1. i see alot of turbo s for sale and they have ccb and center lock wheels. after much research, most likely i will be swapping to steal bbk to avoid heavy costs. the center lock wheels also have a maintenance program (not sure exact details) & not sure if possible to swap to regular bolts.

2. the engines are easily dropped for maintenance but costly.

what else should i be asking or looking into?

i will always love bmw but having them for so long and depreciation working it's magic, i might make the jump .

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

There is no better all around car in the world than the 911 turbo. Supercar performance and handling and also phenomenal quality/fit/finish.
If you're not going to track, the PCCB are perfectly fine. Porsches have the best brakes in the world.

[BMW269]

Sound is the only problem of 911 Turbo, but anyway, that is also the problem of BMW, Audi, Mercedes, McLaren and even Ferrari/Maserati now.

[Meeni]

Swapping to regular bolts is very expensive. Many do it because the inconvenience with the center lock wheels is somewhat high, but it is to be factored in your price calculations.

[Ezio]

Originally Posted by Levi

Sound is the only problem of 911 Turbo, but anyway, that is also the problem of BMW, Audi, Mercedes, McLaren and even Ferrari/Maserati now.

the 911 trubo specially is got to be among the most emotionless engines i have seen in a high end German performance car.

the GT3 on the other hand, is one of the most emotional engines out there. to extremes from Porsche.

[BMW269]

Originally Posted by Ezio

the 911 trubo specially is got to be among the most emotionless engines i have seen in a high end German performance car.

the GT3 on the other hand, is one of the most emotional engines out there. to extremes from Porsche.

What do you think about the next Flat4 and Flat6 the 982 and 992 are going to get? Sure they'll be faster, but what about turbo lag and sound? Porsche guys might be even more upset than BMW guys.

[hl0m4n]

^ the new models will have both positive and negative aspects. positive being the carerra, cayman, etc will be easier to tune being turbo and the negative being it will easily close the gap, power wise, to higher end models such as the turbo.

will be interesting to see nonetheless.

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by Ezio

the 911 trubo specially is got to be among the most emotionless engines i have seen in a high end German performance car.

the GT3 on the other hand, is one of the most emotional engines out there. to extremes from Porsche.

Huh? Not emotionless a all. Have you even driven one? Funny how he 911 turbo can destroy a field of mostly red cars in a best driver's car competition and only lose to two track day specials. Emotionless isn't a word that describes anything about the turbo.

If you want an emotionless car/engine/steering, go drive any current BMW M car.

[Ezio]

Originally Posted by Wolfinwolfsclothing

Huh? Not emotionless a all. Have you even driven one? Funny how he 911 turbo can destroy a field of mostly red cars in a best driver's car competition and only lose to two track day specials. Emotionless isn't a word that describes anything about the turbo.

If you want an emotionless car/engine/steering, go drive any current BMW M car.

matter of fact, my friends bother just picked up a 997 trubo S.

everything about the car is very good. IMO though, in terms of sound and emotion. a Lamborghini, Ferrari or R8 v10 are in complete different leagues.

the problem is that most car reviews and car competitions mainly test performance NUMBERS and how well the car drives. they never really test on a car emotion, because its something hard to test for. and a Ferrari would always win

again the problem with the trubo IMO is sound and emotion. this has NOTHING to do with performance.

[Ezio]

Originally Posted by Levi

What do you think about the next Flat4 and Flat6 the 982 and 992 are going to get? Sure they'll be faster, but what about turbo lag and sound? Porsche guys might be even more upset than BMW guys.

So sad how everything in Germany is going small displacement trubo.

[ashtaron14]

The Centerlock is nice to look at but annoying such that you need a big enough breaker bar/torque wrench to unlock/lock it in place. The CCB does not have as much feel and are not as easy to modulate compared to steel (somewhat on/off). Car burns some oil but it's normal for Porsches to do that.

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by Ezio

matter of fact, my friends bother just picked up a 997 trubo S.

everything about the car is very good. IMO though, in terms of sound and emotion. a Lamborghini, Ferrari or R8 v10 are in complete different leagues.

the problem is that most car reviews and car competitions mainly test performance NUMBERS and how well the car drives. they never really test on a car emotion, because its something hard to test for. and a Ferrari would always win

again the problem with the trubo IMO is sound and emotion. this has NOTHING to do with performance.

I disagree. While it may lack the exhaust note, like all turbo cars, I think it is still a car with a lot of character and emotion. Again, look at where it finished in MT's best driver's car...3rd behind two TRACK DAY SPECIALS. Being a driver's car is not about numbers, but about emotion, and how the car makes you feel. How precise it is, how it drive's, and the eb and flow on the road and track.

Does it have the emotion of a GT3? No...but I dont think any car on the market has more soul, emotion and sense of occassion the GT3 has.

Go drive one of the new turbo Ferraris and tell me a Ferrari would always win, because it wont. Talk about a lackluster car, not only in design but in sound and emotion.

Comparing a 911 turbo to an R8 or Lambo doesnt make much sense. Compared to a GT3, yea, and the GT3 wins all day, every day in emotion.

[Ezio]

Originally Posted by Wolfinwolfsclothing

I disagree. While it may lack the exhaust note, like all turbo cars, I think it is still a car with a lot of character and emotion. Again, look at where it finished in MT's best driver's car...3rd behind two TRACK DAY SPECIALS. Being a driver's car is not about numbers, but about emotion, and how the car makes you feel. How precise it is, how it drive's, and the eb and flow on the road and track.

Does it have the emotion of a GT3? No...but I dont think any car on the market has more soul, emotion and sense of occassion the GT3 has.

Go drive one of the new turbo Ferraris and tell me a Ferrari would always win, because it wont. Talk about a lackluster car, not only in design but in sound and emotion.

Comparing a 911 turbo to an R8 or Lambo doesnt make much sense. Compared to a GT3, yea, and the GT3 wins all day, every day in emotion.

I am not saying the car has no emotion and sounds bad. More so after being in one, I am just looking for more. I still will always think the sound of the car lacks. Where any non turbo 911 the sound is one of the best parts with the sport exhaust. It's just my opinion and I see your view.

[BMW269]

Originally Posted by Wolfinwolfsclothing

Go drive one of the new turbo Ferraris and tell me a Ferrari would always win, because it wont. Talk about a lackluster car, not only in design but in sound and emotion.

Tell that on Ferrarichat or to any Ferrari owner. There are even some on Bimmerpost.

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by Ezio

I am not saying the car has no emotion and sounds bad. More so after being in one, I am just looking for more. I still will always think the sound of the car lacks. Where any non turbo 911 the sound is one of the best parts with the sport exhaust. It's just my opinion and I see your view.

There's a huge lack of sound on a 911 turbo...again most turbo cars this can be said. At least the sound you do get out of it sounds good as opposed to say the turbo M cars, yuck!
I bascially grew up around 911 turbos so they certainly hold a sentinmental place for me...especially since they still had the Mezger engines at that time.
The turbo has become the ultimate GT car and is just as luxuriously appointed as it is performance/handling oriented...dont think theres a better car at any price for what if offers.

[F1Venom]

I know of a guy who ordered a 991 Turbo S and the first thing he did when he picked it up from the dealership (after waiting six months to get it) was to put a protective coat on it and install some $9k exhaust.
But my favorite Porsche has got to be the 991 GT3, the others aren't worth the money.

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by F1Venom

I know of a guy who ordered a 991 Turbo S and the first thing he did when he picked it up from the dealership (after waiting six months to get it) was to put a protective coat on it and install some $9k exhaust.
But my favorite Porsche has got to be the 991 GT3, the others aren't worth the money.

Sounds like your experience with them is very limited to say that. And from someone who drives an M3 nonetheless.

Funny how the 991S/4S, which are essentially entry level are better to drive than any M car, any AMG, GTR, McLaren, Vipers, Corvettes, Ferraris, and insert any other high performance car.

[F1Venom]

I've driven a 991S and was very underwhelmed. Sure it was fun and sounded great, but it wasn't that much more exciting than my M3. An Audi R8 or a Ferrari F430 on the other hand won't perform as well as a 991S, but for around the same price they're more exciting. I'm not bashing on Porsche because I do love them, but besides the GT3 I'd rather have other others for the price of a 991S.

[Kartelli]

Originally Posted by F1Venom

I've driven a 991S and was very underwhelmed. Sure it was fun and sounded great, but it wasn't that much more exciting than my M3. An Audi R8 or a Ferrari F430 on the other hand won't perform as well as a 991S, but for around the same price they're more exciting. I'm not bashing on Porsche because I do love them, but besides the GT3 I'd rather have other others for the price of a 991S.

Felt the same way, after years of hearing everyone and their mother bowing down to the 911 a few months ago, I finally took one for a 45 min test drive. My reaction was similar, unless you going 991T or GT3, there are many other cars that can get you 95% the same experience for much cheaper. I walked away wondering if I was from a different planet.

[F1Venom]

The motors of the 991S and the S65 V8 are really similar because of their high revving nature. And since my M3 has an Akrapovic slip on, it didn't sound any worse than the Porsche with the optional sports exhaust. The Porsche dealer offered me $50k for my M3 and the Porsche was $122k. That means I'd be ponying up $70k for a car that's not that much better than the M3.

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by F1Venom

I've driven a 991S and was very underwhelmed. Sure it was fun and sounded great, but it wasn't that much more exciting than my M3. An Audi R8 or a Ferrari F430 on the other hand won't perform as well as a 991S, but for around the same price they're more exciting. I'm not bashing on Porsche because I do love them, but besides the GT3 I'd rather have other others for the price of a 991S.

I certainly disagree. Don't think either an f430 or an r8 are as exciting to drive as a 991S.
To be even close to a 991S you need an r8 v10 or a 458 both of which are 2-3X more expensive and still aren't better driver's car.

The 991S motor is much torquier than the s65, and the m3 isn't even on the same planet as a 991S performance/handling wise.

The GT3 amongst the line up is a bargain though. For 130K you get a car that competes and or beats 600+ hp cars (458 Speciale, McLaren 650S). The GT3 RS is going to be something out of this world.

Originally Posted by Kartelli

Felt the same way, after years of hearing everyone and their mother bowing down to the 911 a few months ago, I finally took one for a 45 min test drive. My reaction was similar, unless you going 991T or GT3, there are many other cars that can get you 95% the same experience for much cheaper. I walked away wondering if I was from a different planet.

A Mustang GT gets you 99% of the experience of an M3 and in many cases better performance for 1/2 the price...guess you should have bought one of those instead.

[Ezio]

Originally Posted by F1Venom

The motors of the 991S and the S65 V8 are really similar because of their high revving nature. And since my M3 has an Akrapovic slip on, it didn't sound any worse than the Porsche with the optional sports exhaust. The Porsche dealer offered me $50k for my M3 and the Porsche was $122k. That means I'd be ponying up $70k for a car that's not that much better than the M3.

IMO if a 991S started at 75k. I would get one. but they are WAYYYY to much money. paying well over 100k for a 911S is beyond me.