[GrussGott]

Does anybody know if BMW of Manhattan is owned by BMW AG? I know Audi does/used to have "Audi Forums" around the world but they didn't sell cars - this sounds like a similar concept, but does sell cars, albeit via a US incorporated company.

A factory-owned, 69,000-square-foot Mini of Manhattan dealership on 11th Avenue at West 57th Street and a renovated BMW of Manhattan store on West 57th Street between 10th and 11th avenues. The Mini store opened in January, but the exterior is not finished. The BMW store will be completed in the first quarter of 2013. The combined cost of the projects is $60 million.

Originally Posted by BavarianFanatic

It actually IS a thing...

http://www.autonews.com/article/2012...-state-of-mind

Originally Posted by MRCUR

Are you talking about this dealer? http://www.bmwnyc.com/dealership/about.htm

The dealership's website is pretty clear about who the owner is (hint: not BMW). I don't doubt that BMW was involved in the design/renovation and probably contributed $$$, but I think it's clear who owns the dealership.

So MRCUR I get you're saying that the website is clear, but I went through it and I don't see where ... all it says is that it's owned by BMW of Manhattan, Inc, but doesn't say who owns them.

So I'm curious, does BMW AG own a dealership in the US? Anybody have definitive info on that?

[Mywifes335]

I thought all BMW dealerships are franchises?

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by Mywifes335

I thought all BMW dealerships are franchises?

well independently owned companies, yeah, but that's why I'm curious. about 10 years ago Audi built 'forums' to show off the audi brand in key locations around the world. You couldn't buy cars, but they would help you do everything but ... so I'm curious if, just for NYC, BMW AG owns a dealership in the US somehow. The State of NY no longer allows it, but it sounds like it may have been "grandfathered" in.

And BMW now has "brand stores" and I'm wondering if the BMW Manhattan dealership is one ...

EDIT:

May 11, 2014
To inform, not sell
Audi City is an embodiment of Audi's tag line Vorsprung durch Technik (progress through technology), says Horst Hanschur, head of global network strategy. "Of our brand values, one is sophistication, the second one is progressive, and sporty is a third," he tells Automotive News. "With Audi City we think we touch all three."

Other Audi City stores have since opened in Beijing and Berlin, and one is due to open this year in Moscow. The location of each store is crucial, Hanschur says. Each store must be in a central luxury shopping area popular with both locals and tourists.

Audi isn't the only premium automotive marque opening brand-building storefronts. BMW has just opened its second Brand Store in Brussels, two years after the first one opened along Paris' famous Avenue George V, just around the corner from the Champs-Elysees. Mercedes-Benz has similar outlets in 20 cities, including Tokyo and Milan, Italy. Mercedes said in March at the Geneva auto show that it plans to open 20 more by 2020. But so far none has the technology reach of Audi City.

[Mywifes335]

I'm not too sure. I did a search online and couldn't tell. Although it seems that they've had the same owner for some time.

Most of these dealerships are owned by big groups. For example, Audi of Manhattan is owned by the Open Road Group.

[Dackelone]

BMW doesn't own ANY US dealership. In fact I am pretty sure there are laws preventing any manufacture from selling directly to a customer. Hence the whole Tesla thing.


Now in Germany that's another story. When you go to a Niederlassung - those dealers or Zentrum's ARE owned by the company(BMW AG).


Maybe SCOTT26 could shed some light on this topic ?


Btw... isn't BMW Manhattan one of the worst BMW dealers around? I think I would travel into NJ to see out something better.

[trey100]

The dealerships in Manhattan in that area are factory owned. I think the rationale in my opinion is that owning a car dealership in Manhattan, especially one as big as BMW of Manhattan is not cost effective from turning a profit perspective.

A lot of retail shops in Manhattan are used mostly for advertising more so than net profit. Rents depending where you are in Manhattan are running $300-$3500/sf. Lower rates of course for bigger spaces. Even so, BMW occupies more than 300,000 sf in Manhattan.

http://www.autonews.com/article/2012...-state-of-mind

[MRCUR]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

So MRCUR I get you're saying that the website is clear, but I went through it and I don't see where ... all it says is that it's owned by BMW of Manhattan, Inc, but doesn't say who owns them.

I was never able to find any info to indicate that BMW of Manhattan was owned by another party. As someone else mentioned, the dealership has been around for a long time. I still highly doubt that BMW owns any dealerships in the US.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by trey100

The dealerships in Manhattan in that area are factory owned. I think the rationale in my opinion is that owning a car dealership in Manhattan, especially one as big as BMW of Manhattan is not cost effective from turning a profit perspective.

A lot of retail shops in Manhattan are used mostly for advertising more so than net profit. Rents depending where you are in Manhattan are running $300-$3500/sf. Lower rates of course for bigger spaces. Even so, BMW occupies more than 300,000 sf in Manhattan.

http://www.autonews.com/article/2012...-state-of-mind

The question is do we have more than that article to go on ... I think Dackelone and MRCUR are correct and it's not just a state-by-state thing (as is the case for Tesla) it's also an international corporate direct-sales thing.

I think that article is wrong.

Also, BMW AG does have "brandstores" and NYC isn't listed as one.

[Mywifes335]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

The question is do we have more than that article to go on ... I think Dackelone and MRCUR are correct and it's not just a state-by-state thing (as is the case for Tesla) it's also an international corporate direct-sales thing.

I think that article is wrong.

Also, BMW AG does have "brandstores" and NYC isn't listed as one.

There's a Tesla store inside the Short Hills Mall in NJ.

God, I love that fucking mall.

[trey100]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

BMW doesn't own ANY US dealership. In fact I am pretty sure there are laws preventing any manufacture from selling directly to a customer. Hence the whole Tesla thing.


Now in Germany that's another story. When you go to a Niederlassung - those dealers or Zentrum's ARE owned by the company(BMW AG).


Btw... isn't BMW Manhattan one of the worst BMW dealers around? I think I would travel into NJ to see out something better.

According to the article I posted, existing factory owned dealerships were grandfathered in. This includes Audi/VW in that same area.

[MRCUR]

Originally Posted by Mywifes335

There's a Tesla store inside the Short Hills Mall in NJ.

Are they allowed to do sales at the store, or is it just a "showroom"? I remember back in 2014 NJ laws changed (or were going to change) to stop Tesla from doing direct sales.

Anyway - if BMW owned dealers existed in the US, I think we'd have heard a lot more about them by this point given how much press Tesla gets over the same concept.

[Mywifes335]

Originally Posted by MRCUR

Are they allowed to do sales at the store, or is it just a "showroom"? I remember back in 2014 NJ laws changed (or were going to change) to stop Tesla from doing direct sales.

Anyway - if BMW owned dealers existed in the US, I think we'd have heard a lot more about them by this point given how much press Tesla gets over the same concept.

As far as I recall they did everything at that location, including placing orders and arranging test drives.

I believe service is done offsite. In the next town over.

Thing is, it's all order-taking. No on the spot sales. Plus they don't operate typical dealer practices like trade-ins or sell other cars.

[trey100]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

The question is do we have more than that article to go on ... I think Dackelone and MRCUR are correct and it's not just a state-by-state thing (as is the case for Tesla) it's also an international corporate direct-sales thing.

I think that article is wrong.

Also, BMW AG does have "brandstores" and NYC isn't listed as one.

The article I posted not only called them factory owned but explained the issue they had with factory owned dealerships and conflicts with privately owned ones. It said the new regulation was passed in 2009 but they were grandfathered. That's a lot of content so it seems reliable.

Also here but same source:

http://www.autonews.com/article/2013...e-trendsetters

[trey100]

Also brand stores could be different. For instance there is a Lexus boutique opening up in the Meatpacking district. It will have a cafe, food, clothing, and show off some cars but no sales unlike BMW of Manhattan.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

Does anybody know if BMW of Manhattan is owned by BMW AG? I know Audi does/used to have "Audi Forums" around the world but they didn't sell cars - this sounds like a similar concept, but does sell cars, albeit via a US incorporated company.




So MRCUR I get you're saying that the website is clear, but I went through it and I don't see where ... all it says is that it's owned by BMW of Manhattan, Inc, but doesn't say who owns them.

So I'm curious, does BMW AG own a dealership in the US? Anybody have definitive info on that?

BMW of Manhattan is owned by BMW of North America LLC. It, like most of the European brand dealers in Manhattan, are owned by the US/North American Import corporations for the manufacturer. This structure is different than Tesla and does not violate consumer laws.

They all share the same beginning. Max Hoffman Motor Cars and are considered to be the most important locations in the country and a tribute to one of the most significant influencers in automotive history.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by miamiten

BMW of Manhattan is owned by BMW of North America LLC. It, like most of the European brand dealers in Manhattan, are owned by the US/North American Import corporations for the manufacturer. This structure is different than Tesla and does not violate consumer laws.

They all share the same beginning. Max Hoffman Motor Cars and are considered to be the most important locations in the country and a tribute to one of the most significant influencers in automotive history.

Interesting ... I found some other background as well. Net-net:

* BMWNA is a subsidiary of BMW AG
* BMWNA is an auto manufacturer: X5 & X6
* BMWNA is an importer of BMW AG automobiles, but dealers are independent with the exception, I guess, of BMW of Manhattan

About BMW OF NORTH AMERICA, LLC

A key subsidiary of BMW, BMW of North America provides marketing, sales, and financial services through almost 900 dealerships and motorcycle retailers. The company imports and manufactures BMW brands, such as the 1, 3, 5, 6, 7 Series; the X5, X6, and M Series models; and the MINI and Rolls-Royce brands. Styles include coupes, convertibles, sedans, roadsters, sports activity, and luxury vehicles. Divisions include BMW Manufacturing (South Carolina), industrial-design firm DesignworksUSA, a parts distribution center, a technology office, a technical training center, and other operations in the US.

Operations

BMW North America has a sales network of almost 340 BMW passenger car and sports activity vehicle centers, about 140 motorcycle retailers, 120 MINI passenger car dealers, and more than 30 Rolls-Royce dealers.

BMW's DesignworksUSA was born out of car design, but has evolved into a consultancy firm for design projects that include mass transit, consumer electronics, motorsports, aerospace, medical, and a lot more in between.

Sales and Marketing

DesignworksUSA has served such major clients as Nokia, Adidas, John Deere, Hewlett Packard, and Boeing.

Financial Performance

BMW's sales in the US rose 17% in 2012 thanks to a strengthening US economy spurring an overall increase in customer spending on automobiles.

Strategy

BMW is moving ahead with several projects that will make their way to the US over the next few years. Electric models, known as Project i vehicles, are being sold in the US, following a 2013 market release. The new cars are marketed under the electric i3 and i8 model names.

In 2013 the company partnered with ABM, a provider of building maintenance and facility services as the preferred electric vehicle charging station installation and service partner for BMW i Centers across the US and Canada.

BMW North America is expanding the production capacity at its plant in South Carolina, which is the exclusive manufacturing plant for all X5 and X6 sports activity vehicles. The company is investing some $900 million to boost capacity from 160,000 vehicles per year to 350,000 by 2014.

BMW is positioned with its luxury model lines for when luxury becomes fashionable again, and the company believes it will. The company's optimism stems from its broad choice of BMW styles and models, as well as the fact that it still offers financing to customers. The BMW Certified Pre-Owned business brings new and younger customers to the brand.

Ownership

BMW of North America, LLC is a subsidiary of iconic German luxury carmaker BMW.

Company Background

Charged to oversee the group's largest single market -- the US -- BMW of North America was established in 1975.

[08njSTEP]

BMWNA is really US only. Canada is not directly affiliated. I worked at BMWNA and asked about a position in a Canadian dealership and it had to be cleared through special channels. My training was paid and intended for US markets only.
BMWNA started in a rented facility in Montvale, NJ and moved to Franklin Lakes, NJ in late 2008 to an owned facility. 2 new $150m ea. buildings. 1 a training center and the other for office work. The training center is UNBELIEVABLE.

[MRCUR]

Originally Posted by miamiten

BMW of Manhattan is owned by BMW of North America LLC. It, like most of the European brand dealers in Manhattan, are owned by the US/North American Import corporations for the manufacturer. This structure is different than Tesla and does not violate consumer laws.

They all share the same beginning. Max Hoffman Motor Cars and are considered to be the most important locations in the country and a tribute to one of the most significant influencers in automotive history.

This definitely makes it seem like BMW directly leases the building - https://commercialobserver.com/2010/...555-west-57th/

It's even called the BMW Building.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by GrussGott

*BMWNA is an auto manufacturer: X5 & X6

*BMWNA is an importer of BMW AG automobiles, but dealers are independent with the exception, I guess, of BMW of Manhattan

In basic (and intentionally confusing) legal corporate structure, BMWNA LLC is the manager of BMW Manufacturing Company. LLC, but both are owned subsidiary of BMWAG.

The import retail network that exists today is just a larger version of what Max Hoffman already had developed. BMW was the last brand he held onto and probably would have remained the distributor until his death had the disagreement with BMW in '74 not occurred. The terms of the sale and settlement agreement in '75 were sealed and most of the details have remained secret. Of the few individuals with knowledge of the specifics, most have since passed away. Continuing to keep the independent franchise model for a period of time was a clause as was present in all his sales of distribution rights. Once that period elapsed, the network had grown so large, there isn't a scenario where it makes sense to change it. It's an impossible scenario, but hypothetically, if BMWNA wanted to reclaim all the US franchises, the cost would exceed the value of the entire BMW Group. The few remaining independent stores that are potentially available now have asking prices in the high 8 - low 9 figure range. Dealerships are expensive to operate and require large amounts of initial capital expenditure.

There will be more "corporate" stores popping up in strategic markets but it won't become a common practice. Porsche Cars NA has a couple of very interesting surprises coming soon.

[JoosyJoos]

Not directly related but I work for Mercedes-Benz. Mercedes-Benz of Manhattan is the only MBUSA owned dealership in the country. I'm not sure if that's the case with BMW but there is nothing prohibiting manufacturers from owning dealerships, at least in the state of New York.

[GrussGott]

Originally Posted by JoosyJoos

Not directly related but I work for Mercedes-Benz. Mercedes-Benz of Manhattan is the only MBUSA owned dealership in the country. I'm not sure if that's the case with BMW but there is nothing prohibiting manufacturers from owning dealerships, at least in the state of New York.

There is since 2009, but the ones there now were apparently grandfathered in.

The BMW, Mini, Mercedes, VW and Audi stores are factory-owned dealerships. The Nissan and Infiniti stores are being built by Bay Ridge Automotive Group of New York.

Afraid the new stores would draw business from other new-car dealers, the dealer association successfully lobbied for state legislation banning factory-owned stores in New York state. The law took effect in 2009, but existing stores and projects that were under way were grandfathered in, Schienberg said.[Mark Schienberg, president of the Greater New York Automobile Dealers Association]

[hollandog]

Originally Posted by JoosyJoos

Not directly related but I work for Mercedes-Benz. Mercedes-Benz of Manhattan is the only MBUSA owned dealership in the country. I'm not sure if that's the case with BMW but there is nothing prohibiting manufacturers from owning dealerships, at least in the state of New York.

Do your coworkers give you a hard time on your BMW?