[Riceball777]

My hexon 600rr turbos are on the way and i will need to updrand my stock clutch. Should i go with the spec 2+ or 3+

[DennisPacMo]

I have an acquaintance running the RR550's with the Stage 2+ Spec on the DMFW. Works well and feels stock. We just did a Stage 3+ and SMFW conversion. It's too aggressive and heavy for normal street use in my opinion. The friction material is very "on/off" in its feel so it can chatter a little if you're trying to be smooth footed.

[Lshaw]

I have Spec 3+ Mfactory Smfw. I disagree with above. I DD 50+ miles a day city/hwy, Pedal feel is firmer than stock but not heavy by any means. By aggressive, the clutch will give you instant feedback and is precise on engagement, but this makes driving that much more enjoyable. If you know how to properly rev match, you will be perfectly fine.

Torque capacity: 545 and 671 respectively. So if you exceed 545 with your goals, then go 3+. Drivability will be the same.

Flywheel: I would imagine Hexon 600rr would be putting you over 500whp, so it is recommended to go with smfw.


I remember your thread on noise of this setup. I can tell you that there will be clutch rattle, and there is clutch chatter in lower rpms. That is the normal and to be expected with a lighter flywheel. I am fully catless with idle raised to 850 and rattle noise is 4/10, some days it could be quieter/louder.

[djkevinnn]

^ this guy knows what he's talking about. I got the same clutch set up as him after test driving his car. Spec 3+ feels great, it's just very grabby, once you get used to that it's only slightly stiffer than stock.

[FRMTL2_335i]

Do the 3+, 2+ is only good for stock turbos. Once u go over 550wtq the stage 2+ pressure plate warps bcuz it's weak and a POS.

[logicc]

Seems like everybody is just assuming OP is going to tune the hell out of his car. Would probably help if specified what his goals are too. But I'm also running the 600RR and have a spec 2+ on new Lux DMFW too and it feels very much like stock which is what I was looking for (engagement point on the clutch is a bit shorter though). So if looking for OEM feel 2+ should do it for ya

[Grand_hustle17]

I went with stg2 that mounts to oem flywheel. Supposedly thats a tad less harsh. Waiting for car from the shop now. Driven on stg 2+ and did not like it. Pedal felt 150% stiffer imo. Took away from the luxury aspect for me personally

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

If you keep the torque conservative you can do 2+ if you plan on maxing out the tune and setup 3+.

I'd say go with the 3+ as everyone always wants to turn it up!

[JasW]

Just bumping this to add that the Spec 3+ can be necessary even with stock turbos. Adding inlets and outlets put me just at the 500whp/550wtq line, and that has proved too much even for my (now late) 335is clutch. I don't want to dial it down, so the Spec 3+ is on the way . . . .

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

You can get away with 2+ at 500WHP.

Around 500-550WHP the stock DMFW can become imbalanced depending on the age and abuse. A fresh DMFW can probably handle 500WHP no issue.

So at 500WHP, we recommend most folks to go with a single mass flywheel.

[JasW]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

You can get away with 2+ at 500WHP.

Around 500-550WHP the stock DMFW can become imbalanced depending on the age and abuse. A fresh DMFW can probably handle 500WHP no issue.

So at 500WHP, we recommend most folks to go with a single mass flywheel.

I suppose you can get away with it, but probably not for a long period. Actually, I don't think one can ever get any real longevity out of performance clutches, but I'm banking on being better off with the 3+ than the 2+.

I should mention I had a new IS clutch and OEM DMFW put in last year, and didn't have much more than 11K miles on it... toast. Not sure why some people want to "upgrade" to an IS clutch.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by JasW

I suppose you can get away with it, but probably not for a long period. Actually, I don't think one can ever get any real longevity out of performance clutches, but I'm banking on being better off with the 3+ than the 2+.

I should mention I had a new IS clutch and OEM DMFW put in last year, and didn't have much more than 11K miles on it... toast. Not sure why some people want to "upgrade" to an IS clutch.

I wasn't going to say it but since you brought it up, I never felt the 335is was worth all the hype. People took my remark as a "sales pitch" but I genuinely believed it was only marginally better then the stock clutch and really wouldn't last any longer.

As far as 3+ vs 2+. You'll likely get more mileage out of the 2+. I know guys with over 40K on that clutch.

3+ won't last as long. It has more clamping force and bite but at the cost of wear.

Consider the 2+ if you don't have the necessary power for the 3+.

[Dkhan22]

I have the 2+ with OEM dmfw. I'm running a single turbo with no fueling modifications. It's good for now. Let's see how it reacts with an upgraded fuel pump, then port injection. Currently have 60k miles on it.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by Dkhan22

I have the 2+ with OEM dmfw. I'm running a single turbo with no fueling modifications. It's good for now. Let's see how it reacts with an upgraded fuel pump, then port injection. Currently have 60k miles on it.

All depends on the torque. Especially with the single the torque isn't too bad usually.

The 2+ was put on the map on a Single Turbo kit making 600WHP.

[JasW]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

I wasn't going to say it but since you brought it up, I never felt the 335is was worth all the hype. People took my remark as a "sales pitch" but I genuinely believed it was only marginally better then the stock clutch and really wouldn't last any longer.

As far as 3+ vs 2+. You'll likely get more mileage out of the 2+. I know guys with over 40K on that clutch.

3+ won't last as long. It has more clamping force and bite but at the cost of wear.

Consider the 2+ if you don't have the necessary power for the 3+.

It's academic because the 3+ is on its way, but I can only hope you're wrong! If the torque I'm putting down is enough to easily kill the 335is clutch, I'm just afraid the 2+ might be too borderline.

The last thing I want is to have to replace my clutch every year, but that appears to be the road I'm on now. I had the original clutch on my 335is replaced with a new IS clutch just a year ago right after going FBO (and after about 2-3 months of running a Wedge custom MHD tune when I was otherwise stock). So this will be my third clutch. Ouch.

If anything, this is a wake up call for me as an MT driver -- you always see people saying "I've been running 22 psi or 500+whp on this platform since the Paleozoic era without problems" and you realize they're AT drivers.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by JasW

It's academic because the 3+ is on its way, but I can only hope you're wrong! If the torque I'm putting down is enough to easily kill the 335is clutch, I'm just afraid the 2+ might be too borderline.

The last thing I want is to have to replace my clutch every year, but that appears to be the road I'm on now. I had the original clutch on my 335is replaced with a new IS clutch just a year ago right after going FBO (and after about 2-3 months of running a Wedge custom MHD tune when I was otherwise stock). So this will be my third clutch. Ouch.

If anything, this is a wake up call for me as an MT driver -- you always see people saying "I've been running 22 psi or 500+whp on this platform since the Paleozoic era without problems" and you realize they're AT drivers.

We have guys with 600+ HP/ 550WTQ on 2+

I wish I was wrong but I'm not basing this on opinion just experience of the 100's we've sold to people in this platform.

We see the 3+ guys back a lot sooner, in fact I don't think we ever had a 2+ guy need a new clutch yet. I'm not sure where you purchased but I could have turned that package around for you and sent you a 2+.

As far as how soon it will go will depend on your driving habits and abuse. At the end of the day summer tires wear out sooner then an average all season eco tire. Performance brake pads wear out sooner then stock OE or Eco pads. It's the nature of gaining performance out of materials that wear.

One should choose the clutch kit that falls into the torque range of their power at the end of the day. Spec is also notorious for being conservative on their torque rating.

Best of luck.

[M-335]

One should choose a clutch based on power & intended use. I can burn through a stage 2+ in know time at 450wtq at the track & you can have a stage 3+ for 40k miles at 650wtq if you don't beat on the car. It's all relative

[JasW]

Originally Posted by Jeff@TopGearSolutions

We have guys with 600+ HP/ 550WTQ on 2+

I wish I was wrong but I'm not basing this on opinion just experience of the 100's we've sold to people in this platform.

We see the 3+ guys back a lot sooner, in fact I don't think we ever had a 2+ guy need a new clutch yet. I'm not sure where you purchased but I could have turned that package around for you and sent you a 2+.

As far as how soon it will go will depend on your driving habits and abuse. At the end of the day summer tires wear out sooner then an average all season eco tire. Performance brake pads wear out sooner then stock OE or Eco pads. It's the nature of gaining performance out of materials that wear.

One should choose the clutch kit that falls into the torque range of their power at the end of the day. Spec is also notorious for being conservative on their torque rating.

Best of luck.

Thanks, Jeff, and thanks for your advice, but I'm going with the advice of the guys at the performance shop who do all of the major work on my car, and who know me and know my car. One thing I've learned -- and I learned it at a financial cost -- is that the cars on this platform, like their drivers, are all individuals. My 335is E93 with a 6MT is not the same as the next guy's 335is E93 with a 6MT, nor is my driving style the same.

Spec has listed the torque capacity for the 2+ at 545wtq. Perhaps that is conservative, but nevertheless it's just a hair below where I'm at. Maybe or probably I'd make out, but I'd be gambling, and in any event, if I were to go single turbo in a year or so, obviously it would not suffice. We'll see.

[Grand_hustle17]

I have RR600 (soon to be removed) and im running regular stage 2 spec and no issues.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by JasW

Thanks, Jeff, and thanks for your advice, but I'm going with the advice of the guys at the performance shop who do all of the major work on my car, and who know me and know my car. One thing I've learned -- and I learned it at a financial cost -- is that the cars on this platform, like their drivers, are all individuals. My 335is E93 with a 6MT is not the same as the next guy's 335is E93 with a 6MT, nor is my driving style the same.

Spec has listed the torque capacity for the 2+ at 545wtq. Perhaps that is conservative, but nevertheless it's just a hair below where I'm at. Maybe or probably I'd make out, but I'd be gambling, and in any event, if I were to go single turbo in a year or so, obviously it would not suffice. We'll see.

I hear ya. You'll be fine though. Best of luck.

Originally Posted by BMW M335

One should choose a clutch based on power & intended use. I can burn through a stage 2+ in know time at 450wtq at the track & you can have a stage 3+ for 40k miles at 650wtq if you don't beat on the car. It's all relative

Well that's for sure but regardless of that. Some clutch materials simply wear faster then others so if you had = driving habits (although impossible) one would wear out sooner then the other, that's all I was saying.