Did I just ruin my car? OMG!

pb4ugo2bed · 09-09-2018, 12:34 AM

I desperately need some help and advice from the experts here. I was doing the install for the xDrive downpipes and I dropped the subframe for the install as recommended by most people that have done the xDrive downpipes. I've got the pipes in, but now my subframe is not lining up properly! The bolt holes are at least an inch apart from lining up and the passenger side wheel at the front is touching the bumper. see the pic below. How do I go about realigning the subframe so I can bolt this back up? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated!!

m3atloaf · 09-09-2018, 12:45 AM

You need to get under with a medium pry bar. Look at the engine mounts you are probably caught on one or both engine mounts.

pb4ugo2bed · 09-09-2018, 12:58 AM

Thanks so much for the reply. I think you're right. It does look like I'm caught on the motor mounts, for sure the one on the passenger side. Should I take the jack out from under the subframe to correct that? I'm not sure how I would pry that while it's being supported. Ugh, so stressed right now.

pb4ugo2bed · 09-09-2018, 09:09 AM

I think I understand the tragic flaw in my process that lead to my current problem. I should never have done this job on ramps... I should have put the car on jack stands so that the suspension would naturally hang down. But now I'm not sure how to go about getting the car on jack stands while still supporting the engine from underneath. Sigh, fml. I should have just got a shop to do this... now I can't even get it towed in it's current condition.

cruizinmax · 09-09-2018, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pb4ugo2bed

I think I understand the tragic flaw in my process that lead to my current problem. I should never have done this job on ramps... I should have put the car on jack stands so that the suspension would naturally hang down. But now I'm not sure how to go about getting the car on jack stands while still supporting the engine from underneath. Sigh, fml. I should have just got a shop to do this... now I can't even get it towed in it's current condition.

OMG!

You did it on ramps? You are extremely lucky the car didn't fall and crush you.

As far as fixing this, get some jacks that can lift it off the ramps. Also get a engine support to hang the engine from the top and go from there. Good luck and be careful.

weehe126 · 09-09-2018, 11:20 AM

Wait, you dropped the subframe without an engine brace? So the engine was only held up by the transmission mounts...

pb4ugo2bed · 09-09-2018, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weehe126

Wait, you dropped the subframe without an engine brace? So the engine was only held up by the transmission mounts...

No, there's a jack under the car supporting the engine.

cortez08 · 09-09-2018, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pb4ugo2bed

Quote:

Originally Posted by weehe126

Wait, you dropped the subframe without an engine brace? So the engine was only held up by the transmission mounts...

No, there's a jack under the car supporting the engine.

You need to order a strut engine support ASAP.

pb4ugo2bed · 09-09-2018, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cortez08

You need to order a strut engine support ASAP.

I've been looking at those. Harbor Freight has one for only $75... other users seem to have had success using it. It would be a hell of a lot easier getting the car up on jack stands if I was using one of those instead of a floor jack.

Thanks for the suggestion!

cortez08 · 09-09-2018, 05:51 PM

Here is the one I just bought. Used it once already and it works great. X-drive downpipe installation is not easy without it.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B004U...op_mb_pd_title

PA66400 · 09-09-2018, 06:35 PM

1. Go to Princess Auto if there is one near you and buy the Harbor Freight engine support bar - they sell the same one under their Power Fist brand. Or, cross the border into Michigan and buy one at Harbor Freight.

2. Use your tow hook to be the engine block contact point for the support brace (there is a threaded hole for this by the oil filter housing) and put the brace in place to lift/support the engine - this will let you get rid of the floor jack under your oil pan. Look this up in this forum - there is a DIY for the turbo replacement that has pictures showing how to do this.

3. Put the car on 4 jackstands. You will need a couple of floor jacks for this and may need to put the jacks for the front of the car under large blocks of wood (i.e. 6x6) because the jacks may not extend to the height of your ramps without the block as a spacer. You will have to jack both sides at the same time - near to the jackpads (risk of indenting bodywork while doing this). It will be tricky and you will need help to jack both sides at the same time. Another way to do it would be to buy a 6"x6"x8' timber and put that crossway under car at the front jackpads and then jack up the left and right sides simultaneously under the center of the timber, to lift the car by the front jackpads off of the ramps. You can then put jackstands under the 6x6 at each front jackpad.

Best to put jackstands under the two rear jackpads before doing the above, so the car becomes level with the height of the front ramps. Your jacking location at the rear is in the centre of the rear subframe crossmember just behind your differential. I put a floor jack there with a hockey puck on the metal cup of the floor jack - it will lift both sides at the same time, so you can get the rear jackstands in place at the same time.

4. With the car on jackstands, the (currently unsupported but fully loaded with weight) front suspension will unload and hang free and you can get the subframe back in place.

Just a comment, you could have crushed yourself here and/or seriously damaged your car. Don't try any more manipulation of the subframe with the car the way it is now until you have the engine properly supported (outlined above). Suggest reading thoroughly the abundant DIY's available for subframe dropping in the future.

fredcase · 09-09-2018, 08:16 PM

The front two sub frame bolts have a locating pins on them. Get those 2 in lose first. Then pry the rest in. Use caution when getting them all tight. The motor mounts have little locating pins also that need to be persuaded into place also.

I usually leave the 2 front subframe bolts in, but, at the end of their threads, while up ON JACKSTANDS to get the downpipes out on my xdrive.

feuer · 09-09-2018, 09:55 PM

Start the car, put in gear, move forward few inches until everything line up perfectly.

Bimmer_Engineer · 09-09-2018, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feuer

Start the car, put in gear, move forward few inches until everything line up perfectly.

Lol

MysticRob · 09-10-2018, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feuer

Start the car, put in gear, move forward few inches until everything line up perfectly.

I swear the Bentley manual says to reverse at high speed into a "solid object" (solid object part # should be available at dealership parts dept) so inertia causes the subframe to continue backward as the rest of vehicle stops suddenly and it all lines up.

nsjames · 09-10-2018, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feuer

Start the car, put in gear, move forward few inches until everything line up perfectly.

along those lines though, I would put the tow hook into the bumper and use a come along to try and bring the chassis forward to where the subframe is.

Donutz · 09-11-2018, 07:45 AM

Use the wheel to roll the subframe back in place. You might need help to hold the wheel back while you thread the bolts into the subframe. Simply put your hands on the wheels and forcefully roll towards the rear of the car; being an internet guru I'll say "trust me, it works"... Don't ask how I know...

Faredo · 09-11-2018, 03:17 PM

For your own safety. no NOT do any more of your own work. You've made mistakes that can literally kill you.

Unknown_Car · 09-11-2018, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pb4ugo2bed

I desperately need some help and advice from the experts here. I was doing the install for the xDrive downpipes and I dropped the subframe for the install as recommended by most people that have done the xDrive downpipes. I've got the pipes in, but now my subframe is not lining up properly! The bolt holes are at least an inch apart from lining up and the passenger side wheel at the front is touching the bumper. see the pic below. How do I go about realigning the subframe so I can bolt this back up? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated!!

You should never taken the subframe down
I did plenty of xi downpipes and never had to take the subframe down. Did my single turbo also didnt take my subframe down. Dont listen to every one that says you should, they don't know how to look around.
Put a jack to hold your motor, take the engine mounts out and have othe jack to hold your subframe and start loosening. Then just start threding one bolt on any side of subframe first then line the other side and install the bolts.

pb4ugo2bed · 09-22-2018, 12:26 PM

I took some of the constructive advice offered from some of the helpful folks here, and I'd like to thank m3atloaf, cruizinmax, cortez08, PA66400, fredcase, nsjames, Donutz, and Roma_335i for the tips. I ordered the engine support bar from Harbour Freight (even got a 20% off promo!) and it finally arrived yesterday. I spent lastnight carefully and methodically getting the car transferred from the ramps to a proper set of jack stands. As you can see from the photo below, things are looking much better now!

I'm going to be finishing the job today finally but I'm having trouble locating the torque specs for the 6 subframe bolts and the 4 E-torx bolts. I've seen some contradictory torque values... does anyone happen to know what the values are? Or perhaps tell me where I can locate them? Thanks again!

pb4ugo2bed · 09-22-2018, 09:03 PM

I stumbled across a post for a turbo swap and it sounds like they used 80ft lbs for the 6 large sub-frame bolts and 18ft lbs for the 4 e-torx bolts that thread into the motor mounts. Can anyone confirm those values? Much appreciated!

dpaul · 09-23-2018, 08:45 AM

80ft/lb for the subframe bolts, 20ft/lbs for e-torx into bottom of engine mount

Values from ISTA/D

Edit: 20 ft/lbs if your torx bolts are M8; 28 ft/lbs oif yours are M10. Yours are probably M8, since I also have a 2009 335xi and they are M8

09-09-2018, 12:34 AM	#1
pb4ugo2bed New Member 4 Rep 27 Posts Drives: 2009 335i xDrive Sedan Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Sault Ste. Marie, ON iTrader: (0) Garage List 2009 BMW 335i xDriv ... [0.00]	Did I just ruin my car? OMG! I desperately need some help and advice from the experts here. I was doing the install for the xDrive downpipes and I dropped the subframe for the install as recommended by most people that have done the xDrive downpipes. I've got the pipes in, but now my subframe is not lining up properly! The bolt holes are at least an inch apart from lining up and the passenger side wheel at the front is touching the bumper. see the pic below. How do I go about realigning the subframe so I can bolt this back up? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated!! __________________ 2009 335i xDrive Sedan /// Mod List: MHD Stage 2+ Tune, Synapse BOV/Chargepipe, ARM Motorsports FMIC, VRSF Downpipes, 19" Rohana RF-2's, M-Sport Blackout Grills
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09-09-2018, 12:45 AM	#2
m3atloaf New Member 5 Rep 25 Posts Drives: Blue 335i Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Bay iTrader: (0)	You need to get under with a medium pry bar. Look at the engine mounts you are probably caught on one or both engine mounts.
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09-09-2018, 12:58 AM	#3
pb4ugo2bed New Member 4 Rep 27 Posts Drives: 2009 335i xDrive Sedan Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Sault Ste. Marie, ON iTrader: (0) Garage List 2009 BMW 335i xDriv ... [0.00]	Thanks so much for the reply. I think you're right. It does look like I'm caught on the motor mounts, for sure the one on the passenger side. Should I take the jack out from under the subframe to correct that? I'm not sure how I would pry that while it's being supported. Ugh, so stressed right now. __________________ 2009 335i xDrive Sedan /// Mod List: MHD Stage 2+ Tune, Synapse BOV/Chargepipe, ARM Motorsports FMIC, VRSF Downpipes, 19" Rohana RF-2's, M-Sport Blackout Grills
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09-09-2018, 09:09 AM	#4
pb4ugo2bed New Member 4 Rep 27 Posts Drives: 2009 335i xDrive Sedan Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Sault Ste. Marie, ON iTrader: (0) Garage List 2009 BMW 335i xDriv ... [0.00]	I think I understand the tragic flaw in my process that lead to my current problem. I should never have done this job on ramps... I should have put the car on jack stands so that the suspension would naturally hang down. But now I'm not sure how to go about getting the car on jack stands while still supporting the engine from underneath. Sigh, fml. I should have just got a shop to do this... now I can't even get it towed in it's current condition. __________________ 2009 335i xDrive Sedan /// Mod List: MHD Stage 2+ Tune, Synapse BOV/Chargepipe, ARM Motorsports FMIC, VRSF Downpipes, 19" Rohana RF-2's, M-Sport Blackout Grills
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09-09-2018, 11:20 AM	#6
weehe126 Brigadier General 1189 Rep 3,228 Posts Drives: 2017 340i Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: San Antonio iTrader: (2)	Wait, you dropped the subframe without an engine brace? So the engine was only held up by the transmission mounts...
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09-09-2018, 05:51 PM	#10
cortez08 Private 60 Rep 80 Posts Drives: 2008 335xi Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: Lehigh Valley PA iTrader: (0)	Here is the one I just bought. Used it once already and it works great. X-drive downpipe installation is not easy without it. https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B004U...op_mb_pd_title
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09-09-2018, 06:35 PM	#11
PA66400 Private First Class 16 Rep 154 Posts Drives: 2008 335i Sedan Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Calgary, AB iTrader: (0)	1. Go to Princess Auto if there is one near you and buy the Harbor Freight engine support bar - they sell the same one under their Power Fist brand. Or, cross the border into Michigan and buy one at Harbor Freight. 2. Use your tow hook to be the engine block contact point for the support brace (there is a threaded hole for this by the oil filter housing) and put the brace in place to lift/support the engine - this will let you get rid of the floor jack under your oil pan. Look this up in this forum - there is a DIY for the turbo replacement that has pictures showing how to do this. 3. Put the car on 4 jackstands. You will need a couple of floor jacks for this and may need to put the jacks for the front of the car under large blocks of wood (i.e. 6x6) because the jacks may not extend to the height of your ramps without the block as a spacer. You will have to jack both sides at the same time - near to the jackpads (risk of indenting bodywork while doing this). It will be tricky and you will need help to jack both sides at the same time. Another way to do it would be to buy a 6"x6"x8' timber and put that crossway under car at the front jackpads and then jack up the left and right sides simultaneously under the center of the timber, to lift the car by the front jackpads off of the ramps. You can then put jackstands under the 6x6 at each front jackpad. Best to put jackstands under the two rear jackpads before doing the above, so the car becomes level with the height of the front ramps. Your jacking location at the rear is in the centre of the rear subframe crossmember just behind your differential. I put a floor jack there with a hockey puck on the metal cup of the floor jack - it will lift both sides at the same time, so you can get the rear jackstands in place at the same time. 4. With the car on jackstands, the (currently unsupported but fully loaded with weight) front suspension will unload and hang free and you can get the subframe back in place. Just a comment, you could have crushed yourself here and/or seriously damaged your car. Don't try any more manipulation of the subframe with the car the way it is now until you have the engine properly supported (outlined above). Suggest reading thoroughly the abundant DIY's available for subframe dropping in the future. Last edited by PA66400; 09-09-2018 at 07:43 PM..
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09-09-2018, 08:16 PM	#12
fredcase Captain 261 Rep 776 Posts Drives: Bmw=trash Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Noyb iTrader: (1)	The front two sub frame bolts have a locating pins on them. Get those 2 in lose first. Then pry the rest in. Use caution when getting them all tight. The motor mounts have little locating pins also that need to be persuaded into place also. I usually leave the 2 front subframe bolts in, but, at the end of their threads, while up ON JACKSTANDS to get the downpipes out on my xdrive.
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09-09-2018, 09:55 PM	#13
feuer Major General 4289 Rep 9,226 Posts Drives: wife crazy! Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Chicago, IL iTrader: (5)	Start the car, put in gear, move forward few inches until everything line up perfectly.
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09-11-2018, 07:45 AM	#17
Donutz Lieutenant 140 Rep 476 Posts Drives: 335i Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Toronto, eh iTrader: (2)	Use the wheel to roll the subframe back in place. You might need help to hold the wheel back while you thread the bolts into the subframe. Simply put your hands on the wheels and forcefully roll towards the rear of the car; being an internet guru I'll say "trust me, it works"... Don't ask how I know...
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09-11-2018, 03:17 PM	#18
Faredo Lieutenant 318 Rep 404 Posts Drives: 335i Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Arkansas iTrader: (0)	For your own safety. no NOT do any more of your own work. You've made mistakes that can literally kill you. __________________ Mods related to trouble shooting posts: Stock Turbos, MHD OTS V7 stage 2+ 93 oct, VRSF Downpipes, VRSF Relocated inlets, CTS Turbo 7" Intercooler, Tial BOV with upgraded line 5.56mm, index 12 injectors, A/T OEM Flash.
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09-22-2018, 12:26 PM	#20
pb4ugo2bed New Member 4 Rep 27 Posts Drives: 2009 335i xDrive Sedan Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Sault Ste. Marie, ON iTrader: (0) Garage List 2009 BMW 335i xDriv ... [0.00]	I took some of the constructive advice offered from some of the helpful folks here, and I'd like to thank m3atloaf, cruizinmax, cortez08, PA66400, fredcase, nsjames, Donutz, and Roma_335i for the tips. I ordered the engine support bar from Harbour Freight (even got a 20% off promo!) and it finally arrived yesterday. I spent lastnight carefully and methodically getting the car transferred from the ramps to a proper set of jack stands. As you can see from the photo below, things are looking much better now! I'm going to be finishing the job today finally but I'm having trouble locating the torque specs for the 6 subframe bolts and the 4 E-torx bolts. I've seen some contradictory torque values... does anyone happen to know what the values are? Or perhaps tell me where I can locate them? Thanks again! __________________ 2009 335i xDrive Sedan /// Mod List: MHD Stage 2+ Tune, Synapse BOV/Chargepipe, ARM Motorsports FMIC, VRSF Downpipes, 19" Rohana RF-2's, M-Sport Blackout Grills Last edited by pb4ugo2bed; 09-22-2018 at 01:21 PM.. Reason: Adding Photo
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09-22-2018, 09:03 PM	#21
pb4ugo2bed New Member 4 Rep 27 Posts Drives: 2009 335i xDrive Sedan Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Sault Ste. Marie, ON iTrader: (0) Garage List 2009 BMW 335i xDriv ... [0.00]	I stumbled across a post for a turbo swap and it sounds like they used 80ft lbs for the 6 large sub-frame bolts and 18ft lbs for the 4 e-torx bolts that thread into the motor mounts. Can anyone confirm those values? Much appreciated! __________________ 2009 335i xDrive Sedan /// Mod List: MHD Stage 2+ Tune, Synapse BOV/Chargepipe, ARM Motorsports FMIC, VRSF Downpipes, 19" Rohana RF-2's, M-Sport Blackout Grills
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09-23-2018, 08:45 AM	#22
dpaul Lieutenant Colonel 657 Rep 1,893 Posts Drives: 2009 E90 335xi, 2011 E93 M3 Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Boston iTrader: (3)	80ft/lb for the subframe bolts, 20ft/lbs for e-torx into bottom of engine mount Values from ISTA/D Edit: 20 ft/lbs if your torx bolts are M8; 28 ft/lbs oif yours are M10. Yours are probably M8, since I also have a 2009 335xi and they are M8 Last edited by dpaul; 09-23-2018 at 09:03 AM..
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