[Coupes33]

Over the last week, I have been playing around with a little project to see if I can reduce the Intake Air Temperature (IAT). I have used a pump and cooling radiator out of a computer and a $5 plastic container from Woolies. The idea is to circulate ice cold water through the radiator which is positioned between the intake air duct and the intake air filters. What I have built is very basic at present and can be greatly improved. I am using ice cubes which of course only last a few minutes. But the aim was to see if there was potential for further development. I tried it out today and did datalogs before use and while in use. Ambient temperature was 28 C (82F). I got a 7 F improvement which I thought was promising. There is a heap of improvements I have in mind which should improve the results a lot more.





Datalog without using device
https://datazap.me/u/coupes44/datalo...g=0&data=14-21

Datalog while using device
https://datazap.me/u/coupes44/datalo...g=0&data=14-21

[Aus335iguy]

Interesting coupes. I always thought the best place to cool was post turbo?

There's a post somewhere about using the m4 water to air intercooler. Apparently it fits straight on to our manifold. That means the aftermarket ones would work as well... the only exception is that the outlets need to go over the top of the engine.......

I was looking at buying a 7.5inch VRSF cooler but stopped in my tracks when water to air cooling is on the table.

[Coupes33]

Originally Posted by Aus335iguy

Interesting coupes. I always thought the best place to cool was post turbo?

There's a post somewhere about using the m4 water to air intercooler. Apparently it fits straight on to our manifold. That means the aftermarket ones would work as well... the only exception is that the outlets need to go over the top of the engine.......

I was looking at buying a 7.5inch VRSF cooler but stopped in my tracks when water to air cooling is on the table.

I agree Aus that the water to air IC is the best way to go. Before I bought and installed my 7.5" Race VRSF IC, I looked at trying to install a water to air IC in the same space but gave that idea away. I am of the understanding that any reduction in temperature before the turbos will also reduce the IAT after the turbos and help increase the power through more dense air (more oxygen). I proved that with my little project. I just like fiddling around with different ideas.

[Brule]

Any reason you cant just run the container with ice with direct hoses to each intake and run a fan in place of a pump?

Place a bit of guaze fine sheet to stop ice sucking in and allow cool air in. Probably dont need a fan even just another opening to allow air to come in the container somewhere opposite outlet hoses and just get air drawn straight into the intake.

???

Or what about a esky in the boot. 1 feed to each intake. 1 inlet in esky lid with small kn filter. 1 physical valve that can be turned in or off.

Thr intake should just draw the cool air in without a pump or fan. Turn it on before burnout turn it off after your run.??

[Coupes33]

Originally Posted by Brule

Any reason you cant just run the container with ice with direct hoses to each intake and run a fan in place of a pump?

Place a bit of guaze fine sheet to stop ice sucking in and allow cool air in. Probably dont need a fan even just another opening to allow air to come in the container somewhere opposite outlet hoses and just get air drawn straight into the intake.

???

Or what about a esky in the boot. 1 feed to each intake. 1 inlet in esky lid with small kn filter. 1 physical valve that can be turned in or off.

Thr intake should just draw the cool air in without a pump or fan. Turn it on before burnout turn it off after your run.??

Thanks Brule for your suggestions. The future changes that I am currently working on are:
1. Replace the plastic container with a insulated stainless steel item which I have ordered.
2. Place a coiled copper pipe in the container and make the water circuit through the pump and radiator closed so it circulates the same water around and around.
3. Replace the ice cubes with dry ice.
4. Make a shroud from the intake duct that fans out to cover the whole of the radiator. This will slow the velocity of the air entering the radiator and give it more time to chill. It will also insulate the radiator from the engine compartment heat when moving. When in motion, the hottest air entering the radiator will be at ambient temperature.
5. A small computer fan can be installed to cover half of the radiator that when stationary can blow some cold air towards the air filters.

Currently, I have a small gauze filter on the suction of the pump.

[Brule]

Looks like your well on your way.

[Socket]

Is this cheating haha?

[Brule]

If your from the usa putting another transmission or weight reduction is cheating lol
So this definitely is in the eyes of usa.

Lucky where in Aus and can do what you want

[jzx_andy]

Would be interested in some back to back testing and logs on the strip/dyno once you've got the setup working at its peak. Should help the turbos make the same sort of power with slightly less boost and a decent reduction in IAT's, which is always a good thing.

[Socket]

Originally Posted by Brule

If your from the usa putting another transmission or weight reduction is cheating lol
So this definitely is in the eyes of usa.

Lucky where in Aus and can do what you want

Haha 😆

[Coupes33]

Originally Posted by Socket

Is this cheating haha?

It's not cheating Socks. It is just another modification used for drag racing like fitting MT ET Street Radials.

[Coupes33]

Originally Posted by jzx_andy

Would be interested in some back to back testing and logs on the strip/dyno once you've got the setup working at its peak. Should help the turbos make the same sort of power with slightly less boost and a decent reduction in IAT's, which is always a good thing.

Once I get it working fully, I will log each run at the drag strip. The use of dry ice will make a large difference. The temperature of ice water is -32F while dry ice is -109F.

[Coupes33]

Originally Posted by Brule

If your from the usa putting another transmission or weight reduction is cheating lol
So this definitely is in the eyes of usa.

Lucky where in Aus and can do what you want

Your right on the money with this statement. I remember when Duck did 10.1s, Tony Vargas VTT didn't believe Duck's car met his requirements for the platform because he was running a powerglide. I think that has changed a lot now as there are a few in the USA running 4L80E transmissions and some are full drag cars.

[Aus335iguy]

Originally Posted by Coupes33

Your right on the money with this statement. I remember when Duck did 10.1s, Tony Vargas VTT didn't believe Duck's car met his requirements for the platform because he was running a powerglide. I think that has changed a lot now as there are a few in the USA running 4L80E transmissions and some are full drag cars.

Amazing how jealousy makes people behave.

[juld0zer]

A couple of suggestions from when I had my N55:
- Insulate the TMAP sensor using exhaust wrap with a layer of foil sarking on top, silver side out.
- Sheet of sarking over the top radiator hose, silver side facing the hose

I drive in a lot of traffic and this provided some decent improvements in IAT vs ambient. I didn't feel much improvement though. It's more of a driveability thing for some cars. My 370z would be beaten by taxis and Civics at the lights on hot days.

In your application I wonder if buying BMW's special tool to activate the radiator fan at full blast would help? You'd need a high current power supply or external battery to run it though. Only problem is that you might have to buy it from USA or Europe.

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...le-83302348135

[Coupes33]

Originally Posted by juld0zer

A couple of suggestions from when I had my N55:
- Insulate the TMAP sensor using exhaust wrap with a layer of foil sarking on top, silver side out.
- Sheet of sarking over the top radiator hose, silver side facing the hose

I drive in a lot of traffic and this provided some decent improvements in IAT vs ambient. I didn't feel much improvement though. It's more of a driveability thing for some cars. My 370z would be beaten by taxis and Civics at the lights on hot days.

In your application I wonder if buying BMW's special tool to activate the radiator fan at full blast would help? You'd need a high current power supply or external battery to run it though. Only problem is that you might have to buy it from USA or Europe.

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...le-83302348135

Thanks for the tips. I must admit that I don't know what "sarking" is. I find that the hottest engine part that is in the vicinity of the air filters is the oil filter housing.

[kookie]

Originally Posted by Coupes33

It's not cheating Socks. It is just another modification used for drag racing like fitting MT ET Street Radials.

Paint it black.... No one can see.

[juld0zer]

Sarking is foil material used in house construction. Normally the shiny side faces inwards so you only see the coloured side during construction. This refects radiant heat very effectively and costs very little if you can find a mate who has some leftovers. Otherwise a roll from Bunnings is pretty expensive considering you only a small piece.
It is tough so you can pierce it and cable tie it together over the exhaust wrap. Air gaps are important so don't wrap the sarking tightly.

Exhaust wrap prevents conductive heat (heat transfer from contact between sarking and pipe/sensor). It essentially delays heating and cooling, so the downside to consider is that once heated, the object will retain heat for longer but I've found the effect to be negligible.

[Coupes33]

Originally Posted by juld0zer

Sarking is foil material used in house construction. Normally the shiny side faces inwards so you only see the coloured side during construction. This refects radiant heat very effectively and costs very little if you can find a mate who has some leftovers. Otherwise a roll from Bunnings is pretty expensive considering you only a small piece.
It is tough so you can pierce it and cable tie it together over the exhaust wrap. Air gaps are important so don't wrap the sarking tightly.

Exhaust wrap prevents conductive heat (heat transfer from contact between sarking and pipe/sensor). It essentially delays heating and cooling, so the downside to consider is that once heated, the object will retain heat for longer but I've found the effect to be negligible.

Thank you for that explanation.

[Coupes33]

I have almost completed version 2 of the IAT reduction kit. I have modified the intake duct I got from Socks so that the intake air goes through a larger area of the radiator than the previous version. The plastic container has been replaced with a insulated stainless steel container (a larger capacity container would still be better). The water circuit through the radiator is now closed circuit. Dry ice will be placed in the container. The closed water circuit has a coiled copper pipe in the container.

[DR-JEKL]

So obviously setup for drag racing how long would each load of dry ice last you reckon?

[Coupes33]

Originally Posted by DR-JEKL

So obviously setup for drag racing how long would each load of dry ice last you reckon?

Yes Shane, it is just for the drags. The next test is getting some pellet dry ice and see how long it lasts and how low it drops the IAT.