[M3C_Thanos]

[nicky dj]

Originally Posted by slowestn54(4)life

Yeah. E100 and PS2 hi-flow turbos.

[M3C_Thanos]

Originally Posted by nicky dj

Yeah. E100 and PS2 hi-flow turbos.

Originally Posted by nicky dj

Yeah. E100 and PS2 hi-flow turbos.

E100 .. lol

[Zach1328]

Oh boy - where to even start. There are so many pieces to what may otherwise seem like a simple question. Hopefully I can keep this somewhat short.

Can a TT N54 make 700whp? Yes

Is it a realistic goal? Yes, with deep pockets.

For an N54 to realistically make 700+whp the supporting mods are endless if you're going to do it the right way. Parts alone could run $12-15k+. We're talking turbos, fueling, axles, LSD, clutch, brakes, suspension, upgraded oil cooler(s), inlets/outlets, other bolt-ons, etc. If you're not DIY'ing this...tack on an extra $5k+. Then there will be extensive tuning to dial in the setup, dyno days, etc. You're easily looking at $20k+ into the car if you aren't DIY'ing.

Congrats - you've got your 700whp setup. Now, the massive low-end torque from the twin turbos is absolutely brutal on the engine. Sure you can tune out of this by limiting boost and torque down low, but at that point you may be better off with a large single. If you're pushing big low-end torque through the N54 it's not a matter of if it lets go, but rather when.

You may get lucky and simply drop compression. Not too bad to build the motor from there but still a likely $5k+ expense. You may also be part of the crew that grenade the engine punching a hole through the block. At this point, you need a new engine and should probably opt for the wise decision of building the new engine. Add that cost on top of the motor.

So let's circle back to the initial costs. Don't go cheap - if you want to realistically push 700+whp on twin turbos just go ahead and build the motor up-front. All in all, you're looking at AT LEAST $15-25k. Even with a built motor there is the chance things go south. Pushing TT's to their limits may result in blown turbos. Among plenty of other things to go wrong on a 700whp N54.

Not trying to kill dreams, but it is what it is. I'd love to have a 700whp TT N54 but I cannot justify the cost. If you're willing and able to set aside $30k for up-front costs and potential issues then I say go for it. If you're expecting to throw on some turbos and fueling mods and make 700whp then I suspect we will see a thread about you parting out the car within the year.

[nicky dj]

Originally Posted by slowestn54(4)life

E100 .. lol

Lol. E or 100 octane is what I meant...

[Ozzie335i]

Dare I suggest an LS swap.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Ozzie335i

Dare I suggest an LS swap.

Question is: 700whp n54 TT

[nicky dj]

Originally Posted by feuer

Question is: 700whp [SIZE="4"]n54[/SIZE] TT

+1

[Ozzie335i]

What part of "Dare I..." did you two guys miss?

Pushing either of these somewhat small engines, be it the N55, or oh so superior (with it's forged crank and rods, woo hoo) N54 to 700 whp is pushing it.

The bottom line is anyone coming here asking if they can do such a thing should not be trying to do it as that is a question you should already have an answer to. Why not ask I have 20 k to blow on an engine that I hopefully can come back and impress you cool guys with dyno stats. Never mind that it may grenade under test. OP, I suggest you go with a set of Pure 2s and an e85 custom tune, get maybe 575 or 600, and enjoy the thrill ride. On the street that should be enough, videos of street pulls be damned.

[nicky dj]

Originally Posted by Ozzie335i

What part of "Dare I..." did you two guys miss?

Pushing either of these somewhat small engines, be it the N55, or oh so superior (with it's forged crank and rods, woo hoo) N54 to 700 whp is pushing it.

The bottom line is anyone coming here asking if they can do such a thing should not be trying to do it as that is a question you should already have an answer to. Why not ask I have 20 k to blow on an engine that I hopefully can come back and impress you cool guys with dyno stats. Never mind that it may grenade under test. OP, I suggest you go with a set of Pure 2s and an e85 custom tune, get maybe 575 or 600, and enjoy the thrill ride. On the street that should be enough, videos of street pulls be damned.

That wasn't the question. Of course all sorts of issues can happen at 700+ hp/25psi+ and of course you have an unreliable ticking time bomb; hell I know someone that broke his driveshaft in half at 700+ on PS2's. Is it possible with TT's, yes.

There are hundreds+ of people that I've come across running ST setups in the 6-700-1000hp range. Can TT's do 700 issues aside, yes.

OP hasn't mentioned if this setup is what he's looking for. Simple question deserves a simple answer.

[Ozzie335i]

"There are hundreds+ of people that I've come across running ST setups in the 6-700-1000hp range. Can TT's do 700 issues aside, yes."

Hundreds? Really? Do enlighten me with the one guy that has a 1000 hp N5x. And still no 9 second quarter mile trap times? How many of these 600 - 700 whp peeps first came here asking what the cool guys here thought should be done to get there? Sheesh DJ, anyone undertaking such a venture would not be reaching out on the net for advice, they should already know what needs to be done. No offense OP.

[nicky dj]

Originally Posted by Ozzie335i

"There are hundreds+ of people that I've come across running ST setups in the 6-700-1000hp range. Can TT's do 700 issues aside, yes."

Hundreds? Really? Do enlighten me with the one guy that has a 1000 hp N5x. And still no 9 second quarter mile trap times? How many of these 600 - 700 whp peeps first came here asking what the cool guys here thought should be done to get there? Sheesh DJ, anyone undertaking such a venture would not be reaching out on the net for advice, they should already know what needs to be done. No offense OP.

What do you not understand that the simple question was asked and answered? If someone asked the question that has been asked infinite amount of times "could I shoot flames out of my exhaust?" and nothing else... I wouldn't answer "you could but you would eventually fry your cats, causing you turbo seals to fail prematurely, drastic oil loss, etc." It wasn't asked "can I shoot flames and what are some concerns or issues I should be aware of shooting flames?" or 700+hp in this case.

Everyone on here that tunes their car takes some sort of risk whether it be a small percentage or a ticking time bomb the more PSI you push. You've been on the forums long enough I assume to see a lot of these builds but sure I'll enlighten you anyways: Motiv's, AJ at EMP tuning has 2 builds, Panda, BQ, Amit... Vargas' setup with forged everything - pistons, rods, heads. Student Driver is up around 850-900tq, Mercless, Boosted Billy, alzilla...

[langsbr]

Originally Posted by Zach1328

Now, the massive low-end torque from the twin turbos is absolutely brutal on the engine.

I constantly hear this repeated, but I have yet to see it in practice. The only dyno I've seen with "too much" or "excessive" low end torque is VTTs dynos that Tony did when maxing them.

Every other twin turbo hybrid setup that I've seen on the dyno has made the same, if not less torque than most of the 700+ whp singles. I compared a number of 600+ WHP twin turbo dynos to the 700+ single dynos (regardless of what everyone says, there aren't hundreds of each posted daily) and the 6266 singles made more torque and power even at low rpms. I was quite surprised myself as I held the belief of opposite. Transient response may be different, but steady state single gear acceleration, the singles made more.

Also, what is the 'consequence' of this brutality from too much torque? There is the oft repeated 'rod bending' torque claim, but when you think about it logically, torque won't bend rods. To bend a rod, the rod must be compressed essentially. On the power stroke, there is no force acting on the bearing side of the rod, and on the compression side there is no force acting on the piston side. There is forces on both sides which can bend rods when there is detonation. Guess where detonation is most damaging? Low rpm, high load. So it's not torque that's bending rods, it's detonation. Get a new tuner.

[iqraceworks]

I wonder how many of these "daily driver" 700hp 335i's are actually daily drivers?

[iqraceworks]

Originally Posted by langsbr

I constantly hear this repeated, but I have yet to see it in practice. The only dyno I've seen with "too much" or "excessive" low end torque is VTTs dynos that Tony did when maxing them.

Every other twin turbo hybrid setup that I've seen on the dyno has made the same, if not less torque than most of the 700+ whp singles. I compared a number of 600+ WHP twin turbo dynos to the 700+ single dynos (regardless of what everyone says, there aren't hundreds of each posted daily) and the 6266 singles made more torque and power even at low rpms. I was quite surprised myself as I held the belief of opposite. Transient response may be different, but steady state single gear acceleration, the singles made more.

Also, what is the 'consequence' of this brutality from too much torque? There is the oft repeated 'rod bending' torque claim, but when you think about it logically, torque won't bend rods. To bend a rod, the rod must be compressed essentially. On the power stroke, there is no force acting on the bearing side of the rod, and on the compression side there is no force acting on the piston side. There is forces on both sides which can bend rods when there is detonation. Guess where detonation is most damaging? Low rpm, high load. So it's not torque that's bending rods, it's detonation. Get a new tuner.

Where do you think torque comes from? Cylinder pressure = compression = twisting force on the crankshaft = torque.

That being said.....most rods get destroyed because of excessive RPM's.....that's why lots of race motors run aluminum or titanium rods, to get the reciprocating mass down.

Detonation will eat a piston way before it hurts a rod.

At least that's been my experience....

[RIP_E46COUPEMANUAL]

Originally Posted by Zach1328

Oh boy - where to even start. There are so many pieces to what may otherwise seem like a simple question. Hopefully I can keep this somewhat short.

Can a TT N54 make 700whp? Yes

Is it a realistic goal? Yes, with deep pockets.

For an N54 to realistically make 700+whp the supporting mods are endless if you're going to do it the right way. Parts alone could run $12-15k+. We're talking turbos, fueling, axles, LSD, clutch, brakes, suspension, upgraded oil cooler(s), inlets/outlets, other bolt-ons, etc. If you're not DIY'ing this...tack on an extra $5k+. Then there will be extensive tuning to dial in the setup, dyno days, etc. You're easily looking at $20k+ into the car if you aren't DIY'ing.

Congrats - you've got your 700whp setup. Now, the massive low-end torque from the twin turbos is absolutely brutal on the engine. Sure you can tune out of this by limiting boost and torque down low, but at that point you may be better off with a large single. If you're pushing big low-end torque through the N54 it's not a matter of if it lets go, but rather when.

You may get lucky and simply drop compression. Not too bad to build the motor from there but still a likely $5k+ expense. You may also be part of the crew that grenade the engine punching a hole through the block. At this point, you need a new engine and should probably opt for the wise decision of building the new engine. Add that cost on top of the motor.

So let's circle back to the initial costs. Don't go cheap - if you want to realistically push 700+whp on twin turbos just go ahead and build the motor up-front. All in all, you're looking at AT LEAST $15-25k. Even with a built motor there is the chance things go south. Pushing TT's to their limits may result in blown turbos. Among plenty of other things to go wrong on a 700whp N54.

Not trying to kill dreams, but it is what it is. I'd love to have a 700whp TT N54 but I cannot justify the cost. If you're willing and able to set aside $30k for up-front costs and potential issues then I say go for it. If you're expecting to throw on some turbos and fueling mods and make 700whp then I suspect we will see a thread about you parting out the car within the year.

So much knowledge. I love this forum.

[blaster3500]

Originally Posted by langsbr

I constantly hear this repeated, but I have yet to see it in practice. The only dyno I've seen with "too much" or "excessive" low end torque is VTTs dynos that Tony did when maxing them.

Every other twin turbo hybrid setup that I've seen on the dyno has made the same, if not less torque than most of the 700+ whp singles. I compared a number of 600+ WHP twin turbo dynos to the 700+ single dynos (regardless of what everyone says, there aren't hundreds of each posted daily) and the 6266 singles made more torque and power even at low rpms. I was quite surprised myself as I held the belief of opposite. Transient response may be different, but steady state single gear acceleration, the singles made more.

Also, what is the 'consequence' of this brutality from too much torque? There is the oft repeated 'rod bending' torque claim, but when you think about it logically, torque won't bend rods. To bend a rod, the rod must be compressed essentially. On the power stroke, there is no force acting on the bearing side of the rod, and on the compression side there is no force acting on the piston side. There is forces on both sides which can bend rods when there is detonation. Guess where detonation is most damaging? Low rpm, high load. So it's not torque that's bending rods, it's detonation. Get a new tuner.

Interesting. I'll have to look some more, but I did some quick comparisons of some 6266 dyno sheets vs my game finisher dyno. Despite limited boost down low and ramping it up towards redline, my car made more power down low.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

I wonder how many of these "daily driver" 700hp 335i's are actually daily drivers?

Yeah, is possible, but pusy foot daily driver. On the bent rods concern, there is an engine rebuild thread on here where engine wasn't even misfiring and had a single bent rod assuming from high loads at low RPMs. Wasn't even tuned I think.

[Ozzie335i]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

I wonder how many of these "daily driver" 700hp 335i's are actually daily drivers?

SlowestN54, This is the reality. Drop 15 or 20 K + labor on a 600 whp ride. It'll provide enough power to keep you in your place, and more likely may stay together. Do get an LSD rear end out back. Don't believe me, Google Cars and Coffee crashes. I'd bet that none of them have positrac, LSD, whatever they are labelled.

[2jzn54]

awkward.. guy promoting his own vid with his burner account he uses to promote his own mechanic services..

[2jzn54]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

I wonder how many of these "daily driver" 700hp 335i's are actually daily drivers?

hi

Was a full time daily in that state for a year+.. Accumulated too many other toys so now it is just whatever the flavor of the day is..

[langsbr]

Originally Posted by blaster3500

Interesting. I'll have to look some more, but I did some quick comparisons of some 6266 dyno sheets vs my game finisher dyno. Despite limited boost down low and ramping it up towards redline, my car made more power down low.

I did my comparisons long before the GFs were available. It was mmp s3s and pure high flow and a couple gcs. Not many people come close to 700whp on hybrids.

I will see if I can find the charts I used and see where yours falls. The rb GF turbos are pretty impressive that's for sure. Kind of surprised by the other dyno posted recently that was down 50whp from yours in what seemed like a more aggressive tune, but it's hard to judge engine condition on the internet