[Andyrt200]

I’ve been running MHD stage 2+ with the MHD gearbox stage 3 flash for the last year. Having fixed all the niggles (waste gates, oil leaks etc) it’s been great. However getting to use any of the power in the UK winter is next to impossible.

Obviously I wouldn’t be trying if it was below freezing but it’s not often that cold here however on just slightly damp roads at about 5 degrees C I have no traction. I have had a 320i sit on my rear bumper as I try to accelerate away from roundabouts a few times, I just can’t get any power down without the traction control light going crazy.

I’m used to driving a much lighter car with 400bhp & no traction control in uk winters, I used to be able to sit on the point of losing traction easily in that, I’m sure it went a lot faster. My fully optioned E93 is a very heavy car so that probably doesn’t help.

I’m used to my right foot being the only form of traction control so I had been driving the 335i in the same way. However a while ago on the cold damp road I tried flooring it to see what happened out of interest, it went a bit but then just cut all power making us almost hit the dash, then a second of full power, pushing us back into the seats then full cut flinging us forward again, my daughter wasn’t amused!

So I’m guessing the traction control isn’t set up to handle the power increases of stage 2+?!

I’ve been much more gentle again since but it just won’t accelerate fast now without flashing the traction lights. Its probably normal for the time of year here but I was just wondering if my extreme test damage anything (no codes came up at any point). Or if there are any mods to the traction control in a similar way to the MHD settings or indeed maybe I should look at reducing the torque limits in MHD?
Though I’d probably just forget I’d done it & have limited power in the warmer weather when I could easily get full power down…

They are good new (though summer) tyres, the wheel alignment is spot on & new springs & shocks all round. As I said in warmer weather its fine. I’m well aware of the effects of temperature on summer tyres, just wondering what work arounds there are. It doesn’t seem right a 320 can just sit on my bumper! I could try turning off the traction control but you don’t have a chance when you noticed someone that close to you!

I don’t expect to be able to get full power down on colder roads but the traction control seems to be cutting too early.

[iqraceworks]

These cars have a hard time hooking up in 1st and 2nd gear in the summer, on dry roads, with good tires.

Winter temps, on damp roads, with summer tires is like being on ice......horrible. You will never be able to put down any power.

The traction control is working like it's supposed to....if you don't want it killing power, turn the traction control all the way off....just be warned that with no traction control, the car can and will get away from you in a hurry.....be careful.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by Andyrt200

I’ve been running MHD stage 2+ with the MHD gearbox stage 3 flash for the last year. Having fixed all the niggles (waste gates, oil leaks etc) it’s been great. However getting to use any of the power in the UK winter is next to impossible.

Obviously I wouldn’t be trying if it was below freezing but it’s not often that cold here however on just slightly damp roads at about 5 degrees C I have no traction. I have had a 320i sit on my rear bumper as I try to accelerate away from roundabouts a few times, I just can’t get any power down without the traction control light going crazy.

I’m used to driving a much lighter car with 400bhp & no traction control in uk winters, I used to be able to sit on the point of losing traction easily in that, I’m sure it went a lot faster. My fully optioned E93 is a very heavy car so that probably doesn’t help.

I’m used to my right foot being the only form of traction control so I had been driving the 335i in the same way. However a while ago on the cold damp road I tried flooring it to see what happened out of interest, it went a bit but then just cut all power making us almost hit the dash, then a second of full power, pushing us back into the seats then full cut flinging us forward again, my daughter wasn’t amused!

So I’m guessing the traction control isn’t set up to handle the power increases of stage 2+?!

I’ve been much more gentle again since but it just won’t accelerate fast now without flashing the traction lights. Its probably normal for the time of year here but I was just wondering if my extreme test damage anything (no codes came up at any point). Or if there are any mods to the traction control in a similar way to the MHD settings or indeed maybe I should look at reducing the torque limits in MHD?
Though I’d probably just forget I’d done it & have limited power in the warmer weather when I could easily get full power down…

They are good new (though summer) tyres, the wheel alignment is spot on & new springs & shocks all round. As I said in warmer weather its fine. I’m well aware of the effects of temperature on summer tyres, just wondering what work arounds there are. It doesn’t seem right a 320 can just sit on my bumper! I could try turning off the traction control but you don’t have a chance when you noticed someone that close to you!

I don’t expect to be able to get full power down on colder roads but the traction control seems to be cutting too early.

Summer tires in winter with stage 2+, with a 400hp+ rear wheel drive car, you will struggle to put power down, that's normal. I tried doing a 3rd gear full throttle log with DSC fully off, and that almost ended very badly, would recommend you don't turn traction fully off in winter.

Traction cuts in, when it detects wheelspin, its doing its job - cutting engine power and braking if necessary.

You could try winter tires and even lower stage map if it makes any difference.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

These cars have a hard time hooking up in 1st and 2nd gear in the summer, on dry roads, with good tires.

Winter temps, on damp roads, with summer tires is like being on ice......horrible. You will never be able to put down any power.

The traction control is working like it's supposed to....if you don't want it killing power, turn the traction control all the way off....just be warned that with no traction control, the car can and will get away from you in a hurry.....be careful.

+1

[335i54n]

what size tires are you running, 275 in the rear really helped.

[Mustafa.e92]

Originally Posted by 335i54n

what size tires are you running, 275 in the rear really helped.

What's the biggest size people have been able to run in the rear

[Andyrt200]

Originally Posted by iqraceworks

These cars have a hard time hooking up in 1st and 2nd gear in the summer, on dry roads, with good tires.

Winter temps, on damp roads, with summer tires is like being on ice......horrible. You will never be able to put down any power.

The traction control is working like it's supposed to....if you don't want it killing power, turn the traction control all the way off....just be warned that with no traction control, the car can and will get away from you in a hurry.....be careful.

Yes, from a standing start it’s probably very hard, I have never really tried, don’t want to strain things too much, also I’m getting too old for such things! Though with the odd try in the dry (with I think Stage 1+) it seemed much better letting me drift a bit before cutting the power off without being too harsh.

I’m taking about rolling at 20 - 30mph normal acceleration, then noticing the guy behind is right up my ass in the 320 so gently trying to pull away from him for fun but getting nothing other than the traction light while he says stuck to my bumper up to the 60mph limit. I guess the 320 probably is about the limit of power you can use in the winter then, a bit annoying though!

It seems odd the if the traction working correctly is such a violent power cut on flooring on a cold wet road, it really seems like it should cut the power more smoothly. I’ve not had many cars to test it when but my other half did have a 2002 golf GTD that was terrible for it with only 150bhp & front wheel drive leaving you going nowhere halfway out of a busy junction. She later got a 2014 VW with 190bhp & the traction control was much better in that cutting the power very smoothly.

We had an bog standard F13 640d for a bit too (the E93 is a much nicer car to drive in every other way) it was so smooth in cutting the power & let you drift a lot before cutting at all, only tried in the dry so not much comparison.

I don’t want to try turning the traction off with my daughter in the car, I could drift all day long in my old 200sx, but not trying with her there. Thinking about it I was setting up the boost controller in the 200sx on the same road in similar conditions & it was going sideways with only 300bhp.

Originally Posted by 335i54n

what size tires are you running, 275 in the rear really helped.

That’s a good point, they are only the standard 255 size. I have got some 275s on nice BBS CH-R rims left from the old E39. I almost forgot I had tried them when I first got the E93 but the arch took a chunk out of the side wall.

They didn’t look like they were going to:





It should only take a bit of arch rolling but I had to have a few goes at getting the rear of the arch to not rub on the E39. So I was putting off trying them again on the E93 as the E39 had never damaged the side walls before I’d done anything to the arch lips.

Most annoyingly we cracked a rim just before selling the E39 which destroyed a brand new 275 tyre, so I can’t just put them on for a quick try again.

I put the standard wheels back on the 530i E39 to sell, the traction control light had never come on in that with the 275s, with all season 235s it was flashing out of every junction!

[335i54n]

i am pre lci and stock sport suspension. i could see 285/295 ez fit with some fender work and spot-on offset but doesn't make sense as 275/35 is more common and better priced.

255/35 is just too small with not enough sidewall imo

[iqraceworks]

I run a 265/35/18.......still doesn't hook up well is 2nd unless you easy into the gas. A 275/35/18 is only around a 1/4" wider....and you might have some rubbing issues depending on what wheels you are running.

Honestly....with the torque these N54's make, combined with the independent rear suspension....they just don't transfer weight to the back like a solid axle Camaro or mustang goes.....these cars are made to handle corners, not hook off the line.

If you really don't want to spin the tires....look into some sort of drag radial tire......but if you ever have them in cold/wet weather.....they are going to be worthless.

[ErvGotti]

In the winter with summer tires there's nothing you could do the address the traction control issue get proper tires. But there's two things that helped me put down the power in the summer. First there's a Tq limiter setting in MHD for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gear. Play around with that setting a bit. It's called limit power per gear.

Second thing surprisingly was the differential support bracket from burger motorsports. I was a bit skeptical, but for $99 I thought why the hell not, I've spent more than that on a night out. It made a massive difference in my 135i. I had to hone out one of the mounting holes on the bracket a bit, as it didn't quite line up. For refence I dyno'd 450 WHP and 490 WTQ.

[studio54]

On damp/humid roads, I guess it's pretty normal.

May I ask your tire brand/model ?

Maybe you could try to flash with linear throttle ticked in MHD options, you will have more control on your throttle. Also maybe you can push one time the DTC button (not the long press), it will give you more allowed slippage while staying relatively safe.

However on a straight dry road, at cold temp (3-5°C), I have no traction issues in winter with summer tires on Stage 2+ (N54 135i) as soon as tires are warmed up. I am running Michelin PS4, 245 at rear.

Concerning the 320i, was it a E90 or a F30 ? cause Stage 1 F30 320i are in the 250hp which is not bad. IMO, 30 to 60 mph is not the ideal range where you will make a huge gap but more like from 60+ mph when the engine will really express itself (but will be dangerous on humid road anyway).

[feuer]

Need adequate tire, good suspension setup, proper alignment and driving skill. If you are able to put power down in one 400hp car that doesn’t make you an expert in putting power down in another 400hp car as they will be different. Why is so strange that 320i can ride your bumper? It’s lighter, better balanced, maybe had better suspension and tires, maybe better driver too.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by feuer

Need adequate tire, good suspension setup, proper alignment and driving skill. If you are able to put power down in one 400hp car that doesn’t make you an expert in putting power down in another 400hp car as they will be different. Why is so strange that 320i can ride your bumper? It’s lighter, better balanced, maybe had better suspension and tires, maybe better driver too.

OP issue is traction,

Having a lot of wheelspin in cold weather, and controlling the car when it wheelspins are two separate issues,

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

OP issue is traction,

Having a lot of wheelspin in cold weather, and controlling the carvwhen it wheelspins are two separate issues,

Yes and traction issue could be from all I wrote about.

[335i54n]

since 275 I really don't have traction issues and even wet it's not that bad. I do have almost everything thrown at the rear, solid mounts, monoballs, m3 arms, diff brace, e92 brace, fresh suspension, quality tires, and I don't run too much camber

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by feuer

Yes and traction issue could be from all I wrote about.

He's trying to put the power down in cold temps, wheelspin is inevitable when you do that, it's not caused by lack of driver skill.

[Andyrt200]

Thanks for all the replies, some very good points & suggestions.

The 320i was an E90, bet he was delighted to be sticking to my rear bumper!

I’ve found in general driving at low temperatures is fine on summers, I think it’s the road being just slightly damp too is the killer (on snow is a different matter of course).

I was told by a performance tyre retailer that a UK summer tyre is a very different compound to an identical tyre from the south of Spain with their temperatures being generally so much higher.

My tyres are 255/30ZR19 Dunlop sport maxx RT2, non runflats. They must have soft side walls because the ride is very smooth for 19s. As pointed out they are probably really to narrow though, I was on stage 1 when I got them with no intention of going higher but you know how it goes…

I have no absolutely no intention of drag racing it so only want normal road tyres, but 275s would very likely be better.

My other half recently had to get a newer car for work so we chose a 2018 G31 540i xDrive (no choice in UK 540i has to be xDrive). That has quite worn original runflat 275/35R19 rear & 245/40s, on the same cold damp road I can floor that & it sticks like glue not flashing the traction at all with the standard 340bhp. As nice as that is it kind of takes the fun out of driving so she & I both generally prefer driving the E93. On warm dry roads the stage 2+ 335i is a lot quicker but obviously this time of year on the damp road the standard 540i would leave it standing.

Single press of the traction button is an interesting one, I thought it put the car into extreme traction mode so as to not let any wheel spin at all but recently I tried to tow a car on wet grass but the 335i just sat there spinning one wheel digging a hole with the other wheel doing nothing after a single press (the xDrive 540i dragged it out no problem after a single press).

I have tried turning the traction off completely in the dry before & the remaining “electric LSD” worked surprisingly well drifting very controllably at relatively low speeds.

I will definitely try changing to the linear throttle ticked that’s a great call.

I’ve spent 20 years having only the throttle pedal as traction control in the properly fast cars so shouldn’t really need the torque limiters. But then again those other cars were all manual so I knew exactly which gear I was in without looking or having it change / kick down on me, so see the point of them.

One question - will a quick re-flash to just change the throttle response wipe the adaptive maps?

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

He's trying to put the power down in cold temps, wheelspin is inevitable when you do that, it's not caused by lack of driver skill.

Oh yes it is, one must know when, where and how.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by feuer

Oh yes it is, one must know when, where and how.

That is obvious, he's not asking about when and where,

he's asking about not being able to put the power down in the cold, this is not due to a lack of driver skill. It maybe due to tires or other issues such as suspension setup, boost etc.

It seems either your being obtuse deliberately or you have a comprehension issue.

[feuer]

Originally Posted by Saif2018

That is obvious, he's not asking about when and where,

he's asking about not being able to put the power down in the cold, this is not due to a lack of driver skill. It maybe due to tires or other issues such as suspension setup, boost etc.

It seems either your being obtuse deliberately or you have a comprehension issue.

Coincidentally I was thinking exactly the same about you.

[studio54]

Originally Posted by Andyrt200

One question - will a quick re-flash to just change the throttle response wipe the adaptive maps?

Just ticking linear throttle should be a short map write (2 minutes) and I think it shouldn't reset any adaptations

[iqraceworks]

If anyone has ever driven a car with summer performance tires on it......in cold/freezing temps.....you know what the issue is. Those tires turn hard as hockey pucks in cold weather. Down right dangerous. Mix in wet roads, and they are sketchy as hell.

Nothing is going to make the car hook up with those tires on it....nothing.