[clairvoyant]

I apologize in advance if I didn't search this thread properly.
I am a newbie in the detailing department.
I usually have someone details my car but. Lately I took my car to the dealer to fix a bunch of issues. They insisted to wash my car although I SPECIFICALLY told them not to. Every time, I got my car back, I always got "the swirl treatment". Off course they are very noticeable since my car is jet black.
There are two BMW dealers in Ottawa and they are very much the same $h1t different piles.
I use porter cable 7424 before for my previous car.
What product do you guys recommend to get rid of those swirls?
I've heard ZPC is good but you can't use that product often as it will destroy the clearcoat.
Thank you for your help

[JayKay335i]

There are hundreds of threads in this section detailing the products used and on what car they were used. There are tons of full write ups on complete detailing including products and how to use them.

You should probably try searching.

[pander5]

ZPC can be used for the life of the car many many times without removing any significant amount of clearcoat. If that's what you've been using and you like it keep using it.

[Detailed Image]

Here's a link to our polishing guide for starters.

ZPC is a mild polish in the grand scheme of things, as pander5 mentioned, you can use it many times over and not worry about removing too much clear coat. On a scale of 1 to 10 in terms of aggressiveness, ZPC probably wouldn't break a 3 or so.

I typically start by using Menzerna Power Finish to assess the imperfections in the paint on a green pad and adjust accordingly.

Hope this helps,

George

[clairvoyant]

That's very clear answer.

Then my next question will be what are the "non abrasive" polishes out there that strong enough to remove swirls WITHOUT removing clear coat. I want to keep my car for a long time.

I've heard Zaino Z5 but not sure anymore.....

Once again, Thank you for your help.

Originally Posted by Detailed Image

Here's a link to our polishing guide for starters.

ZPC is a mild polish in the grand scheme of things, as pander5 mentioned, you can use it many times over and not worry about removing too much clear coat. On a scale of 1 to 10 in terms of aggressiveness, ZPC probably wouldn't break a 3 or so.

I typically start by using Menzerna Power Finish to assess the imperfections in the paint on a green pad and adjust accordingly.

Hope this helps,

George

[Detailed Image]

Originally Posted by clairvoyant

That's very clear answer.

Then my next question will be what are the "non abrasive" polishes out there that strong enough to remove swirls WITHOUT removing clear coat. I want to keep my car for a long time.

I've heard Zaino Z5 but not sure anymore.....

Once again, Thank you for your help.

No product can remove swirls without using abrasives, if it does anything, it'll merely fill them in. Z5 is a sealant with some fillers, but it only really fills very light surface imperfections, deeper marring or imperfections, not so much.

Your best bet is to tackle your paint and get it to the condition you want it to using the least aggressive polishes needed to give you the desired results. Once your paint is like that, if you care for your vehicle properly on a regular basis you'll minimize adding imperfections to the paint and won't need to polish again for a while. When it does come time to polish, you'll probably get away with just a nice finishing polish. If you were to use a finishing polish twice a year, you could probably polish 50+ years and still have some clear coat.

Hope this helps.

[BK]

Yeah, I agree with George 100%. Polishing is all about removing some clear coat! That's how you eliminate or reduce the swirls. Polishing with a PC takes off a teeny, tiny, miniscule amount. You can polish every couple of months for the life of your car (how long will you own it, 5 years? 10?) and you won't have clear coat failure, at least not due to the polishing. Most of us only polish twice a year, anyway. You could go just about forever at that pace. Unless, of course, you are using wool pads and rubbing compound or wet sanding every time.

As for Z5 filling swirls, everyone says that, but I don't see it. You'd need a real glaze product to fill swirls, and then, it's not nearly as effective as polishing. Just polish with your PC and use medium and light polishes, and you'll be fine for the life of your car.

[clairvoyant]

The car dealers here are as dumb as my rusty door nob but then I need to bring my car for warranty service.
I told them not to wash my car, they washed it.
Well, their [un]courtesy washes = swirl treatments.
Now if I want to get rid of those swirls, I am risking to damage the clear coat.
I'll probably keep the car for > 10 years the way the economy right now.
Then the next question will be:
In case I damage the clear coat paint. How much does an average good body shop charge to repaint the clear coat nowadays(preferably thicker clear coat but ONLY the clear coat)?
Thank You

Originally Posted by BK

Yeah, I agree with George 100%. Polishing is all about removing some clear coat! That's how you eliminate or reduce the swirls. Polishing with a PC takes off a teeny, tiny, miniscule amount. You can polish every couple of months for the life of your car (how long will you own it, 5 years? 10?) and you won't have clear coat failure, at least not due to the polishing. Most of us only polish twice a year, anyway. You could go just about forever at that pace. Unless, of course, you are using wool pads and rubbing compound or wet sanding every time.

As for Z5 filling swirls, everyone says that, but I don't see it. You'd need a real glaze product to fill swirls, and then, it's not nearly as effective as polishing. Just polish with your PC and use medium and light polishes, and you'll be fine for the life of your car.

[BK]

You don't want thicker clear. You have to strike a balance between being thick enough to protect the shine, but thin enough not to crack or spiderweb. If you did have clearcoat failure down the road -- you won't, not from polishing out swirls, but if you did -- then it would in all likelihood be confined to the top of the trunk, the hood, a bumper, or some single horizontal panel that gets a lot of sun or where the paint is thin to begin with. The cost of repaint would be the cost of repainting a single panel, usually a few hundred bucks, but it depends on the panel.

Seriously, don't worry so much about the "damage" you are doing when polishing your car due to minor swirls. You're not burning through the clear nearly as quickly as you seem to think. You are going to have zillions of rock chips, dings, and scratches if you actually keep the car for 10 years. Not to mention you'll have gone through 15 HPFPs. Repaint because of polishing is the least of your concerns.

[clairvoyant]

So even using the Lake Country orange polishing pads, I should not damage my paint, right???
http://www.detailedimage.com/Lake-Co...Pad-P58/65-S1/

Originally Posted by BK

Seriously, don't worry so much about the "damage" you are doing when polishing your car due to minor swirls. You're not burning through the clear nearly as quickly as you seem to think. You are going to have zillions of rock chips, dings, and scratches if you actually keep the car for 10 years. Not to mention you'll have gone through 15 HPFPs. Repaint because of polishing is the least of your concerns.

[BK]

Originally Posted by clairvoyant

So even using the Lake Country orange polishing pads, I should not damage my paint, right???
http://www.detailedimage.com/Lake-Co...Pad-P58/65-S1/

No, you will be fine.

[slimmie]

I drive a JB myself, and take extra care when going to the dealership for service.

I request the SA to not wash the vehicle after service is complete, and i also write a note in both english and spanish "NO CAR WASH PLZ" and stick it on the steering wheel. Im thinking about adding another one to the rear view just to be even more positive they wont ^^.

Ive never had my car washed at the dealership with this =D

[clairvoyant]

Where does Zaino ZPC stand based on this comparison chart?
http://www.auto-geek.net/charts/wax-...art-master.htm

Thank You

[pander5]

I'd put it at a 3 or 4.

[clairvoyant]

My car takes a lot of beating from the previous owner (improper washing, those gas station auto wash, etc). I also drive to dusty areas sometime, due to my business (buying a beater is out of the question).

If I have to use a bit aggressive polish such as Meguiars Mirror Glaze #83 Dual Action Cleaner/Polish or Menzerna Super Intensive Polish, How often can I detail in yearly basis without wearing out the paint/clear coat?

Or what product do you recommend? Thank You

[Detailed Image]

Originally Posted by clairvoyant

My car takes a lot of beating from the previous owner (improper washing, those gas station auto wash, etc). I also drive to dusty areas sometime, due to my business (buying a beater is out of the question).

If I have to use a bit aggressive polish such as Meguiars Mirror Glaze #83 Dual Action Cleaner/Polish or Menzerna Super Intensive Polish, How often can I detail in yearly basis without wearing out the paint/clear coat?

Or what product do you recommend? Thank You

You can typically safely polish your paint twice a year with a medium cut polish on a random orbital with no problem. It's when you get into heavy compounding, rotary use or wet sanding where the clear coat can diminish rather quickly.

Menzerna Super Intensive Polish is a great polish. Consider Menzerna Power Finish as another great alternative that finishes down a little better and is slightly less cutting than SIP.

[clairvoyant]

Thank you for your prompt response, Greg/George.
I use a Porter Cable 7424 to polish. When using Menzerna Power Finish PO 203, what kind of "safe" polishing pads should I use/would you recommend?

Thank You

Originally Posted by Detailed Image

You can typically safely polish your paint twice a year with a medium cut polish on a random orbital with no problem. It's when you get into heavy compounding, rotary use or wet sanding where the clear coat can diminish rather quickly.

Menzerna Super Intensive Polish is a great polish. Consider Menzerna Power Finish as another great alternative that finishes down a little better and is slightly less cutting than SIP.