Second Gear Grinding When Cold

catch · 12-19-2009, 01:00 AM

Not sure if this is the right forum, but I didnt see transmission anywhere so I put it here.

Lately when my car is cold, second gear grinds on the way in. At first I thought I just wasnt hitting the clutch hard enough (as we are all lazy with it from time to time) but this is not the case. It feels like its not fully opening to let the gears change. This happens every time I shift into second for the first time after a cold start.
I always let me car warm up for a few minutes. The problem persists even after a 10 minute warm up.
I have given a few tries with the clutch pushed all the way to the ground (meaning I will hold it in first, push the clutch down all the way, pause to make sure its pressed all the way down without a doubt, then shift to second) but still grinds

Has anyone experienced this problem?

Any ideas as to what it could be?

I plan on bringing it in on Monday morning to BMW, the only problem is, it only happens when the car has been sitting for a while, like 8 hours. So it will be hard for me to show them the problem first hand.

Im thinking it could be clutch fluid???

XPO186 · 12-19-2009, 04:01 AM

It's not uncommon... I've a heard of a few folks who have had problems with the 2nd gear synchro while the gearbox is cold. I used to get it even going into 3rd occasionally but it completely goes away once the car and the gearbox are all warmed up. So, I changed MT fluid to Redline MTL and it helped some but found I still had to baby the shifter on really really cold days.

Just last week though, I changed the Redline MTL to RP Synchromax and WOW what a difference. The first time I drove the car after the change, engaging 2nd gear was a night and day different from the factory MT fluid. All the shifts are generally really smooth now.

Mr.5 did a nice write-up on how to do it awhile back.

D.yi · 12-19-2009, 03:36 PM

worn out synchroooos

Moc247 · 12-19-2009, 10:34 PM

I get the same thing when its cold, but only for that first shift into second. Fine after that.

Dan335i · 12-19-2009, 10:56 PM

Never happened to me at all.My advice is to double clutch 1st to 2nd when cold.That should take care of the grinding until it warms up.

catch · 12-20-2009, 12:45 AM

would a worn out syncro be covered under warranty??
im def going to message my service advisor tomorrow.
If he cant do anything Ill try changing the fluid, just seems pre-mature, I have 54000km.

I may sound like an idiot, but I have no idea how to double clutch. Correct me if im wrong but its: clutch down, take it out of first into neutral, release clutch, press clutch, put it in second, release clutch?
Ive been driving stick since i was 17 and have never had to double clutch ever!

Dan335i · 12-20-2009, 12:59 AM

A worn out syncro is definetly covered under warranty.

Panoz · 12-20-2009, 04:05 PM

I had the same issue until 10-12K miles. Then its gone completely.How many miles you have on?

prototyp · 12-20-2009, 11:52 PM

Not uncommon... bunches of threads on these boards about crunchy gearboxes (I spent the last year combing through every one of them). The real takeaway is to have a look at this: http://www.bmwtis.com/tsb/bulletins/...p/B230109g.htm

Print it out, talk it over with your SA.

catch · 12-21-2009, 01:01 AM

great link there^^^
I plan on messaging him first thing Monday morning. I will forward him that link and see what he says.
If its getting replaced, now would be the perfect time, im headed on vacation in a week, so I can leave it there while Im gone.

Thanks for the great help so far everyone! Ill keep you posted

NM_BMW · 12-22-2009, 06:51 PM

I started having the same exact problem. Only 2nd, only cold starts, only the first time into 2nd and only when I reverse out of the driveway. If I drove straight out of the driveway I would never get it. Lately though I haven't had the problem any more. The stretch of road I would normally grind on, I just stay in first until I get to the stop sign and then the first shift into second is fine and doesn't grind. I don't believe that TIS applies to the cold problem. It rarely happens to me at least and only on the really cold nights.

jibaholic101 · 12-22-2009, 08:00 PM

im having the exact same problem on my 135i!

you can check the thread here and compare notes and add to the discussion, it is now 4 pages long...
http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=332969

cn555ic · 12-22-2009, 08:03 PM

These BMWs seem like there are so many glitches to them...Great machinery but the little problems cropping up here and there are quite annoying to hear..
OP, hope you get this addressed.

jibaholic101 · 12-22-2009, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loudboxer

Not uncommon... bunches of threads on these boards about crunchy gearboxes (I spent the last year combing through every one of them). The real takeaway is to have a look at this: http://www.bmwtis.com/tsb/bulletins/...p/B230109g.htm

Print it out, talk it over with your SA.

i printed this out and will hand it to my tech when he begins working on my car...

how does this relate to grinding?

2kaccordocoupe · 12-22-2009, 10:21 PM

My car grinds when going into 2nd and has since delivery, this even happens in the summer. I find that once the tranny warms up it becomes smooth.

Same deal both pre and post cdv removal.

XPO186 · 12-22-2009, 10:32 PM

Srsly consider changing your MT fluid to RP Synchromax. I find you don't need to baby the gearbox as much on cold days. All gears are generally easier/smoother to engage as well.

jibaholic101 · 12-22-2009, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2kaccordocoupe

My car grinds when going into 2nd and has since delivery, this even happens in the summer. I find that once the tranny warms up it becomes smooth.

Same deal both pre and post cdv removal.

have you had this looked at?

Quote:

Originally Posted by XPO186

Srsly consider changing your MT fluid to RP Synchromax. I find you don't need to baby the gearbox as much on cold days. All gears are generally easier/smoother to engage as well.

so the fluid actually helps with this problem?

XPO186 · 12-23-2009, 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jibaholic101

so the fluid actually helps with this problem?

Yes. To a point... just don't expect it to be the magic solution to your problem. It does help more than you think though.

2kaccordocoupe · 12-23-2009, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jibaholic101

have you had this looked at?

Dealer said it was 'normal' to be a little clunky until it warms up. I have the complaint on record so should something happen with the tranny / clutch down the road it will all be documented.

In all honestly it's not that bad at least for me anyway. Just baby shift for the first 10 mins of driving and it's fine. The OP may have a different case tho...

mshahidz · 12-26-2009, 01:22 AM

hey man..i *think* i have a similar problem. I am not sure if its a full out grind, or just some resistance when going into second...keep us updated on whats going on.

id love to check out your ride to hear what the grind is like, i mean if more than one person if having this problem (and it seems many ppl are) its a stronger case with a dealer right?

usc335 · 12-26-2009, 01:42 AM

I used Redline and didn't care for it. I switched to Royal Purple Synchromax for the last 15k miles and the tranny is MUCH better. Second gear still requires babying when cold, but nothing like before. To smooth the 1-2 gear shift, take it easy with the throttle, but shift at ~3500 rpm -- I find it goes in pretty darn smooth when cold...

XPO186 · 12-26-2009, 03:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usc335

I used Redline and didn't care for it. I switched to Royal Purple Synchromax for the last 15k miles and the tranny is MUCH better. Second gear still requires babying when cold, but nothing like before. To smooth the 1-2 gear shift, take it easy with the throttle, but shift at ~3500 rpm -- I find it goes in pretty darn smooth when cold...

+1

I too went from Redline MTL to Synchromax and it is a HUGE improvement. A cold gear box requires just a tiny bit of babying for the first few minutes but after that everything is very smooth and engagement is great. In my experience I feel I really only have to baby the first couple of 1>2 shifts and after that everything feels great.

12-19-2009, 01:00 AM	#1
catch Major General 670 Rep 7,148 Posts Drives: F80 M3 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Thornhill iTrader: (27)	Second Gear Grinding When Cold Not sure if this is the right forum, but I didnt see transmission anywhere so I put it here. Lately when my car is cold, second gear grinds on the way in. At first I thought I just wasnt hitting the clutch hard enough (as we are all lazy with it from time to time) but this is not the case. It feels like its not fully opening to let the gears change. This happens every time I shift into second for the first time after a cold start. I always let me car warm up for a few minutes. The problem persists even after a 10 minute warm up. I have given a few tries with the clutch pushed all the way to the ground (meaning I will hold it in first, push the clutch down all the way, pause to make sure its pressed all the way down without a doubt, then shift to second) but still grinds Has anyone experienced this problem? Any ideas as to what it could be? I plan on bringing it in on Monday morning to BMW, the only problem is, it only happens when the car has been sitting for a while, like 8 hours. So it will be hard for me to show them the problem first hand. Im thinking it could be clutch fluid??? __________________ 2016 F80 M3 Mineral White/Sakhir Orange 2013 BMW S1000RR Flat Silver <stolen> 2007 BMW E92 335i Jet Black/Jade Grey <sold>
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12-19-2009, 04:01 AM	#2
XPO186 Colonel 130 Rep 2,740 Posts Drives: E92 335i Join Date: May 2007 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (19)	It's not uncommon... I've a heard of a few folks who have had problems with the 2nd gear synchro while the gearbox is cold. I used to get it even going into 3rd occasionally but it completely goes away once the car and the gearbox are all warmed up. So, I changed MT fluid to Redline MTL and it helped some but found I still had to baby the shifter on really really cold days. Just last week though, I changed the Redline MTL to RP Synchromax and WOW what a difference. The first time I drove the car after the change, engaging 2nd gear was a night and day different from the factory MT fluid. All the shifts are generally really smooth now. Mr.5 did a nice write-up on how to do it awhile back.
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12-19-2009, 03:36 PM	#3
D.yi Major 52 Rep 1,216 Posts Drives: SB e92 335i Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: SEATTLE iTrader: (0)	worn out synchroooos
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12-19-2009, 10:34 PM	#4
Moc247 Private 11 Rep 86 Posts Drives: '11 e92 M-Sport (LBM) Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Michigan iTrader: (1)	I get the same thing when its cold, but only for that first shift into second. Fine after that. __________________ Chris 2020 M5 Comp Singapore/Aragon
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12-19-2009, 10:56 PM	#5
Dan335i Lieutenant Colonel 33 Rep 1,786 Posts Drives: 07 335i coupe 6MT,w/sp. pack. Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: orange county NY iTrader: (2)	Never happened to me at all.My advice is to double clutch 1st to 2nd when cold.That should take care of the grinding until it warms up.
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12-20-2009, 12:45 AM	#6
catch Major General 670 Rep 7,148 Posts Drives: F80 M3 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Thornhill iTrader: (27)	would a worn out syncro be covered under warranty?? im def going to message my service advisor tomorrow. If he cant do anything Ill try changing the fluid, just seems pre-mature, I have 54000km. I may sound like an idiot, but I have no idea how to double clutch. Correct me if im wrong but its: clutch down, take it out of first into neutral, release clutch, press clutch, put it in second, release clutch? Ive been driving stick since i was 17 and have never had to double clutch ever! __________________ 2016 F80 M3 Mineral White/Sakhir Orange 2013 BMW S1000RR Flat Silver <stolen> 2007 BMW E92 335i Jet Black/Jade Grey <sold>
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12-20-2009, 12:59 AM	#7
Dan335i Lieutenant Colonel 33 Rep 1,786 Posts Drives: 07 335i coupe 6MT,w/sp. pack. Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: orange county NY iTrader: (2)	A worn out syncro is definetly covered under warranty.
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12-20-2009, 04:05 PM	#8
Panoz Lieutenant Colonel 87 Rep 1,575 Posts Drives: E92 Space Grey 335i ,Aero Kit Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: EU iTrader: (0)	I had the same issue until 10-12K miles. Then its gone completely.How many miles you have on? __________________ Procede V4 , Catless DPs, Forge FMIC, Injen Intake, VK Oilcooler, Hartge Quads Exhaust, Modded CDV, Synapse BOV Kit, BMW Performance 335i SSK Kit, P3 vent boost gauge Space Grey 335i -> See more pics HERE
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12-20-2009, 11:52 PM	#9
prototyp Lieutenant 231 Rep 459 Posts Drives: '19 X3 M40i Join Date: May 2005 Location: Bay Area, CA iTrader: (3) Garage List 2019 BMW X3 M40i [0.00] 2021 BMW X5 40i MSport [0.00]	Not uncommon... bunches of threads on these boards about crunchy gearboxes (I spent the last year combing through every one of them). The real takeaway is to have a look at this: http://www.bmwtis.com/tsb/bulletins/...p/B230109g.htm Print it out, talk it over with your SA. __________________ 2019 X3M40i DGM/black vernasca, 2T4, 2VF, ZPX, ZPP, ZDA, DWS06+, etc, etc. Since July'19. 2021 X540i MSport CBM/black merino, 337, ZMP, ZPP, ZPK, etc. Since Dec'20. 2006 330i SGM/black, ZSP, ZPP, 217, HuberOps, M Splits, K Lines, AS 3 on EC-7. Sep'08-July'19.
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12-21-2009, 01:01 AM	#10
catch Major General 670 Rep 7,148 Posts Drives: F80 M3 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Thornhill iTrader: (27)	great link there^^^ I plan on messaging him first thing Monday morning. I will forward him that link and see what he says. If its getting replaced, now would be the perfect time, im headed on vacation in a week, so I can leave it there while Im gone. Thanks for the great help so far everyone! Ill keep you posted __________________ 2016 F80 M3 Mineral White/Sakhir Orange 2013 BMW S1000RR Flat Silver <stolen> 2007 BMW E92 335i Jet Black/Jade Grey <sold>
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12-22-2009, 06:51 PM	#11
NM_BMW Vishnu Powered 74 Rep 2,205 Posts Drives: 335xi, S1000RR Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Proceding iTrader: (7)	I started having the same exact problem. Only 2nd, only cold starts, only the first time into 2nd and only when I reverse out of the driveway. If I drove straight out of the driveway I would never get it. Lately though I haven't had the problem any more. The stretch of road I would normally grind on, I just stay in first until I get to the stop sign and then the first shift into second is fine and doesn't grind. I don't believe that TIS applies to the cold problem. It rarely happens to me at least and only on the really cold nights. __________________ 2008 335xi Sedan \| Titanium Silver \| Black Dakota PROcede v5 \| Vishnu Exhaust \| BMS DCI \| AR Catless DPs \| Helix FMIC \| Stett Charge w/ Tial BOV \| MORR VS8s \| KWv3
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12-22-2009, 08:00 PM	#12
jibaholic101 Brigadier General 170 Rep 3,496 Posts Drives: women wild Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Charleston, SC iTrader: (0)	im having the exact same problem on my 135i! you can check the thread here and compare notes and add to the discussion, it is now 4 pages long... http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=332969 __________________ some italian, german, and japanese ones; and on order more of the same
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12-22-2009, 08:03 PM	#13
cn555ic 460 Rep 18,331 Posts Drives: 335i Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: US iTrader: (6)	These BMWs seem like there are so many glitches to them...Great machinery but the little problems cropping up here and there are quite annoying to hear.. OP, hope you get this addressed.
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12-22-2009, 10:21 PM	#15
2kaccordocoupe Brigadier General 1286 Rep 4,703 Posts Drives: Former ///M Driver Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: The 6ix iTrader: (2)	My car grinds when going into 2nd and has since delivery, this even happens in the summer. I find that once the tranny warms up it becomes smooth. Same deal both pre and post cdv removal.
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12-22-2009, 10:32 PM	#16
XPO186 Colonel 130 Rep 2,740 Posts Drives: E92 335i Join Date: May 2007 Location: Albany, NY iTrader: (19)	Srsly consider changing your MT fluid to RP Synchromax. I find you don't need to baby the gearbox as much on cold days. All gears are generally easier/smoother to engage as well.
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12-26-2009, 01:22 AM	#20
mshahidz Major 130 Rep 1,347 Posts Drives: M4, 991 GT3 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Toronto iTrader: (7)	hey man..i think i have a similar problem. I am not sure if its a full out grind, or just some resistance when going into second...keep us updated on whats going on. id love to check out your ride to hear what the grind is like, i mean if more than one person if having this problem (and it seems many ppl are) its a stronger case with a dealer right?
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12-26-2009, 01:42 AM	#21
usc335 First Lieutenant 67 Rep 383 Posts Drives: 21 M2C\|24 X3 M40i\|08 E92 335 Join Date: May 2008 Location: so cal iTrader: (1)	I used Redline and didn't care for it. I switched to Royal Purple Synchromax for the last 15k miles and the tranny is MUCH better. Second gear still requires babying when cold, but nothing like before. To smooth the 1-2 gear shift, take it easy with the throttle, but shift at ~3500 rpm -- I find it goes in pretty darn smooth when cold...
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