[hawc]

Originally Posted by THE AUTOEXTREMIST

BMW is now two car companies diametrically opposed to each other. There’s the “old” BMW that graces us with the quintessential all-around enthusiast machine - the magnificent 3 Series - and, at least some of their “M” machines (only a few of which can be considered desirable), and then there’s the rest of the company, or, as I like to call it, “BMW Heavy” which specializes in overdone, overwrought land cruisers (X6, 5GT and other assorted crossover-SUVs) that are about as far away as you can get from the concept of the Ultimate Driving Machine.

In BMW’s case I don’t have to ask what happened. You could see this coming ten years ago, when I started this publication. It was right around then that the German automakers led by Mercedes and BMW launched a technological arms race that operated under the assumption that the more technology, the better, with vehicle mass and common sense be damned.

Combine that attitude with the fact that those two automakers felt compelled to chase every possible niche – both real and imagined – on the odd chance that they might actually get a leg up on their rival somehow, and the scenario grew exponentially. And then add in a huge dollop of hubris for good measure, oh, and then let the Bangle-led design era trundle along unfettered until it ran completely amuck and you have a recipe for complete disaster.

Now, we have “BMW Heavy” a purveyor of 5,000+ lb. people movers that have little rhyme or reason in the overall scheme of things. Add in “M” versions of some of those same vehicles, and you increase the hurl factor by about a 100.

Walking around the BMW display at Cobo was a little frightening, no, make that a lot frightening. All the accoutrements were there, the sleek display with cool graphics - the overall look and feel of a BMW display that you’d expect to see at an auto show - but it was as if a cruel plot had been unleashed overnight and the BMW vehicles – at least the vehicles you’d expect from BMW – were nowhere to be found, instead replaced by a posse of lumbering behemoths that could exist quite nicely as the “Official Vehicles of America’s Biggest Loser.”

Fair or unfair?

[Balzz]

The business exists for one reason only, to make money. Everything else is moot.

[Drunk Monkey]

You can argue that the company is a victim of its own success.

To appease its shareholders, the company needs to show growth.

There are only so many 3-series vehicles that the company can sell, hence, the entry into the SUV/SAV segment of the market.

I'm less concerned about the new product introductions as I am about the company's dated designs vis-a-vis competitors such as Audi, which, I believe, has taken a good chunk of market share away (and more disturbingly for BMW executives, has been gaining strong momentum).

[peanuboy]

rather than being critical, I think we should be grateful their "old BMW" side of business still looks after the enthusiasts and building those "enthusiast machines"...

afterall, BMW is a business to maintain/gain market share and make profit

[pdude]

Agree (somewhat), but not everyone wants a kick a$$ e90 , and ppl in the world are getting bigger so a lot can't even fit into a 3 series anymore. BMW as a business has to make money, but as long as we have the 1s, 3s and M's I'll stick around (if I have a job).

[Bimmerista]

I guess to answer the OP's question, yes, I think the critique is fair.

Do I agree with it ? No, not necessarily.

I read that statement as a warning shot across the bow of BMW, meaning, there is always a danger (ding, ding, Porsche) when dealing with a brand that has a very strong brand-ethos, in moving in different directions. The danger of course is the loss of ethos and damaging brand dilution.

However, when done right, moves into new market niches actually increases the reach of the brand without loss of ethos. I believe BMW has until now done a very good job of reaching out without losing its mojo. After all, it evolved from a one trick pony into the brand it is today - BMW in 1970 had, essentially, one model that was sucessfull and many that were not. There was much handwringing when BMW introduced the 5 series and even more when the 7 series was introduced. No one today would argue those moves were wrong or that those models do not belong with the brand. Same with the X5. Bottom line, as long as the sporty dna is baked into the goods, the reasons people like us buy BMWs (driving, handling, engine, tech) will makes us buy the new products -assuming they fill a need/want.

Do I think the world needs the new GT, not really, I don't dig big cars/SUVs, but I do look forward to the upcoming 3 GT. And there are those who will find the GT appealing. As long as the sporty dna of BMW is in it, BMW has succeeded in keeping its mojo from diluting (since I have yet to drive the GT, I really cannot speak to that).

A bit long - sorry.

[Tonybest]

Fair

Porsche has also gone the same direction with the Panamera and Cayenne.. As long as they still build the Cayman, and 911 series... I'll still like that part of the brand.

Last night, I was looking at the 5 GT (550i) and that thing is huge. A 3 GT will be much more desirable (for me).

Adding an M to the X5 and X6 was really too much in my opinion.

I have, IMO again, the prettiest bangled-butt car out there... my beloved E86 ... which I have the previous poster to thank for since he found it for me and twisted my rubber arm to pull the trigger.

[hubble bubble]

Fair, but not sure I agree.

Yeah, I love me e90 because of the way it drives, not for the snob appeal or gadgets. (although I do have heated rear seats)

A friend has an X6 and loves it. It is not my kind of vehicle, but it is much quicker, sportier feeling that the competition from MB, Audi, or even Lexus & Acura. If the market wants these vehicles, BMW should make one - at the sporteir end of the market. Leave the interstatre cruizers to MB.

I just with they'd give me a dipstick so I can check the oil myself and a wheel well in the trunk for a spare tire.

[hawc]

Originally Posted by Balzz

The business exists for one reason only, to make money. Everything else is moot.

Perhaps from a short term perspective yes. But ultimately you'll debase the brand and lose money if you look for short term gain over staying true to what the brand stands for.

The whole cross-over craze is almost worse than the SUV craze. At least from a styling stand point you use to have a car or an SUV. Now you have a disgusting mix of both.

[BMdblU]

Fair enough..

What I say to people.. If you don't like it, don't buy it.

[MechUT]

hawc... it's the way of the world.

Wait till you see what VW apparently has in store for their new pet, Porsche:
http://www.caranddriver.com/news/car...rsche-car_news

[hawc]

I'm okay with those changes. I'll always pick the best car within a brand, rather than stay loyal to one brand or model line no matter what. Right now the Cayman is an incredible car, but the M1 might be the next awesome car, or a '10 Audi S4, or whatever. In general though I'll always lean towards small, light RWD/AWD driver's cars. Over big, slow people movers.

[MechUT]

Originally Posted by hawc

I'm okay with those changes. I'll always pick the best car within a brand, rather than stay loyal to one brand or model line no matter what. Right now the Cayman is an incredible car, but the M1 might be the next awesome car, or a '10 Audi S4, or whatever. In general though I'll always lean towards small, light RWD/AWD driver's cars. Over big, slow people movers.

Agreed... I'm actually looking forward to something smaller and lighter than my 330 next time... and, of course, RWD goes without saying.

I found it interesting, though, that Porsche may make a Q5 clone... enough loyalists were outraged when the Cayenne was introduced. But again, it's the way of the world.

[Oulixes]

Originally Posted by hawc

... I'll always pick the best car within a brand, rather than stay loyal to one brand or model line no matter what. Right now the Cayman is an incredible car, but the M1 might be the next awesome car, or a '10 Audi S4, or whatever. In general though I'll always lean towards small, light RWD/AWD driver's cars. Over big, slow people movers.

Well said. I am driving a 335i only because I still need the space.

[Outlaw 06]

A fair criticism, but BMW's xDrive vehicles should also have been included in the author's definition of "the rest of the company..."

[Outlaw 06]

Originally Posted by peanuboy

rather than being critical, I think we should be grateful their "old BMW" side of business still looks after the enthusiasts and building those "enthusiast machines"...

afterall, BMW is a business to maintain/gain market share and make profit

Unfortunately most 3-Series BMW’s sold today are equipped with slushboxes, xDrive, iDrive, and/or no Sport packages. These vehicles can hardly be considered “enthusiast machines”.

Based on my recent buying experience (November/December 2009), I’d estimate that over 95% of the BMW’s in the northeast have at least two of the above faults. Apparently there are a lot more posers than enthusiasts driving BMWs these days. That’s what makes it so difficult to find a CPO 3-Series vehicle with RWD, 6MT, and ZSP.

In fact, I only found 3 suitable 2007 E90s with RWD, 6MT, and ZSP within 200 miles of my home (in over a month of searching). I had to go all the way to Philadelphia to buy a car that met my minimum requirements.

[Bimmer Al]

Do I agree, somewhat.....but here is what you do. Exercise your free will and do not buy these enormous oversized fuel sucking offerings. I can guarantee if people do not buy their non core offerings they would not be spending so much time bringing them to market. They key here is customer demand, growth and profits. If BMW can build more models leveraging the same platforms and increase margins, they will. As long as they keep producing great driver cars like the 3 and 5, the rest will come and go as the market demand for their other products

[mshahidz]

Taken from BMW's corporate strategy:


""At the end of September 2007, BMW Group took on a new strategic direction. Up to the year 2020, BMW Group intends to strengthen its position within the global motor vehicle market by increasing sales to more than two million automobiles per year.

In addition to striving to grow its existing business, the BMW Group will develop new and profitable areas of activity. At the same time, the BMW Group will invest in future technologies, new vehicle concepts and pioneering drive systems.

The new strategy has been given the name Number ONE, standing for 'New Opportunities' and 'New Efficiency'. This means making the best use of new opportunities and becoming more efficient in order to ensure BMW Group's lead over competitors and to actively shape the company's future."""


I honestly dont find it to be a problem, the big cars that is. Whats wrong with the X5 / X6M models? Porsche has the Cayenne S, Turbo, GTS. Up till about 3-4 years ago, Porsche was basically owning the high-performance SUV market, and then they released the GTS model too. BMW has to stay competitive, and attempt to bring out, better, newer, more awe-inspiring cars than its competitiors. Thats what keeps BMW at the top of their game 20 years down the line.
If BMW doesn't release these GT cars, they risk being years behind in the industry. What if the GT -car industry booms? BMW can't risk being uncompetitive.

Also, this is all apart of the evolution of the industry IMO. If companies were not making bigger, faster cars then we would still be relying on only the roasters as high performance vehicles. Now there are M3 sedans which can allow you to experience a top notch driving experience and still be able to carry a family of 4.

My dad was pretty interested in the 5GT, just because he finds the height of the X5 hard to get into (he had spinal cord surgery). The 5GT have him the cargo room he needs, and a great right height--- it also handles 10x better (obviously).

Anyways, i dont see anyone hating on the E65 Wagons!!!!

[Oulixes]

Those who believe that the concern about BMW direction is misplaced and criticism harsh may complement their enjoyment of the "Joy" slogan by olfactory experience, contributed apparently by BMW Canada Marketing. For details, see
http://www.marketingmag.ca/english/n...21_142913_6820

[M3 vert]

Originally Posted by mohammadz

Taken from BMW's corporate strategy:


""At the end of September 2007, BMW Group took on a new strategic direction. Up to the year 2020, BMW Group intends to strengthen its position within the global motor vehicle market by increasing sales to more than two million automobiles per year.

In addition to striving to grow its existing business, the BMW Group will develop new and profitable areas of activity. At the same time, the BMW Group will invest in future technologies, new vehicle concepts and pioneering drive systems.

The new strategy has been given the name Number ONE, standing for 'New Opportunities' and 'New Efficiency'. This means making the best use of new opportunities and becoming more efficient in order to ensure BMW Group's lead over competitors and to actively shape the company's future."""


I honestly dont find it to be a problem, the big cars that is. Whats wrong with the X5 / X6M models? Porsche has the Cayenne S, Turbo, GTS. Up till about 3-4 years ago, Porsche was basically owning the high-performance SUV market, and then they released the GTS model too. BMW has to stay competitive, and attempt to bring out, better, newer, more awe-inspiring cars than its competitiors. Thats what keeps BMW at the top of their game 20 years down the line.
If BMW doesn't release these GT cars, they risk being years behind in the industry. What if the GT -car industry booms? BMW can't risk being uncompetitive.

Also, this is all apart of the evolution of the industry IMO. If companies were not making bigger, faster cars then we would still be relying on only the roasters as high performance vehicles. Now there are M3 sedans which can allow you to experience a top notch driving experience and still be able to carry a family of 4.

My dad was pretty interested in the 5GT, just because he finds the height of the X5 hard to get into (he had spinal cord surgery). The 5GT have him the cargo room he needs, and a great right height--- it also handles 10x better (obviously).

Anyways, i dont see anyone hating on the E65 Wagons!!!!

Are you referring to the 7 series

[mshahidz]

Originally Posted by M3 vert

Are you referring to the 7 series

I meant the likes of the MB e65/63 wagons, the M5 wagon, the RS6 wagons...those are seriously high performance......pet transporters.

[mekeni]

It's fair.

But then again, BMW needs to grow otherwise it will go the way of the dodo.