[Animalfreeride]

Dear all,

I really need your help as i’m at my wits end with this sh*t. You will note that I have already posted a separate post concerning the proposed change of run flats to non run flats. As you are all too aware, insurance companies are always happy to take our money but the situation changes when it’s their turn to pay out and will try anything to “wriggle” out of a claim. With this in mind not wanting to potentially be £27000 out of pocket should I have the misfortune of writing my car off, I sent Swiftcover the following email.

Dear Sirs,

I am due to change my tyres in the near future owing to general wear and tear. My current vehicle is fitted with run-flat tyres. The tyres that I propose to purchase are of the non run-flat type but are comparable in dimension. I am seeking assurance from you that such a change would not invalidate my policy in the event of a claim.


Yours Sincerely
(Animalfreerife)


I received this reply;


Dear (animalfreeride)

Thank you for your e-mail.

Providing the tyres are the correct size and dimensions for your wheels and are not performance enhancing in anyway then this change from run flat to non-run flat would be fine and would invalidate your policy and any future claims.

Hope this helps.

Kind Regards
Swift Help Team
Swiftcover.com


You will note the half wit appeared to have mis-typed and again knowing what insurance companies are like I sent this;


Dear Sirs,

Thank you for your prompt reply. I gather from your response that you mis-typed and actually meant that a change from run flats to non run flats would NOT invalidate my policy and any future claims?

I would kindly ask if you could clarify before I order the tyres.

Yours faithfully,

(animalfreeride)


and received this;


Thank you for your e-mail.

We apologise for the delay in our response, we are unfortunately receiving a higher volume of e-mails than usual and are currently attempting to clear this backlog.

As long as the manufacture of your vehicle advise that these types are acceptable to be placed on your vehicle and they are non performance enhancing we are able to cover the new tyres.

I hope this helps.


Kind Regards

Swift Help Team
Swiftcover.com


I am absolutely f***ed off by this totally non-commital reply. How the hell do I address the above? I really can't see someone from BMW stating they are quote "acceptable". WTF does "acceptable" mean?

The way I see it at the moment is this;

1) I cancel my insurance and find someone who will cover me with non flats
2) I stick with the dreaded, bone crushing, ear bursting, penny pinching run flats

Apologies for such a long thread but there is some urgency with this as I checked my rears this weekend and have noticed the inner section is down to the ply. I really don't want to go with run flats and had my heart set on normal tyres which most of you seem to indicate transform the car.

[AlanQS]

As I understand it, if a owner objects to a bone crushing ride, BMW dealers are allowed, by BMW, to advise the fitting of non run-flat tyres to help alleviate the problem.

I believe that you can get confirmation of this from BMW so perhaps you should contact BMW service (BMW UK, not a dealer) to confirm this in writing or by e-mail.

I don't know of any other insurance company who would object to this provided the tyres are suitable for the car - size, speed rating, and load rating.

[Animalfreeride]

Originally Posted by AlanQS

As I understand it, if a owner objects to a bone crushing ride, BMW dealers are allowed, by BMW, to advise the fitting of non run-flat tyres to help alleviate the problem.

I believe that you can get confirmation of this from BMW so perhaps you should contact BMW service (BMW UK, not a dealer) to confirm this in writing or by e-mail.

I don't know of any other insurance company who would object to this provided the tyres are suitable for the car - size, speed rating, and load rating.

Thanks Alan, I will write to them this afternoon. I just need to think of the the appropriate wording as you will note that my insurance company need BMW to state they are "acceptable".

[beemerbird]

I am assuming and hoping that both those replies to your e-mails have been written by a junior member of staff.

Personally I would physically write to the Customer Services Manager outlining the past two poor/unclear/unhelpful e-mails. But you say you're on time constraints. Reason being I am unsure whether an e-mail is acknowledged as a legally binding document, certainly isn't where I work. Maybe that's for different legal reasons, I honestly don't know. Another reason is the e-mail could be picked up by any member of staff and you need confirmation from the organ grinder, not the monkey.

Otherwise I would change insurance broker/company, pay a bit more and receive better cover overall, especially in the event of a claim perhaps?

[Animalfreeride]

Originally Posted by beemerbird

I am assuming and hoping that both those replies to your e-mails have been written by a junior member of staff.

Personally I would physically write to the Customer Services Manager outlining the past two poor/unclear/unhelpful e-mails. But you say you're on time constraints. Reason being I am unsure whether an e-mail is acknowledged as a legally binding document, certainly isn't where I work. Maybe that's for different legal reasons, I honestly don't know. Another reason is the e-mail could be picked up by any member of staff and you need confirmation from the organ grinder, not the monkey.

Otherwise I would change insurance broker/company, pay a bit more and receive better cover overall, especially in the event of a claim perhaps?

Beemerbird, good point. I think you are right. Also you can easily minupulate emails in any event and as you say it could be challenged in a civil court. I think I may write to BMW first, followed by Swiftcover. I just what to err on the side of caution with this.

I'm very frustrated as all I want to know is whether they will cover me with normal tyres. It's not bloody rocket science! Also how the hell do I know if they are performance enhancing. They are certainly ride enhancing!

[Silver Shadow]

I had exactly the same exchange of emails with Swift Cover when I changed my runflat tyres last year. Here is a copy of the emails I sent/received.. (first email at the bottom).





Dear Mr Silver Shadow

Thank you for your e-mail.

I have commented your policy with the details below and I can confirm this is an acceptable change to your vehicle.

Kind Regards

Nicola Park

Swift Help Team
Swiftcover.com

Hello,

As per our below conversation, I can confirm that my vehicle is now fitted with non-run flat tyes as of today 27/11/09. The tyres are new premium tyres fitted by a BMW main dealership, which are of the correct speed and load rating specifications. For your records they are Goodyear Eagle F1 Assymetrics.

I would be obliged if you could confirm in writing your acknowledgement of this change to my vehicle to prevent any possible disputes at a later date.

Kind Regards,

Mr Silver Shadow.



Dear Mr Silver Shadow,

Thank you for your e-mail.

This change will not effect your policy providing the tyres meets correct specification for your vehicle.

Kind Regards

Susan Reed
Swift Help Team
Swiftcover.com


Subject: Other/General enquiry

Customer's Question: Please can you confirm that it will not effect my insurance premium if I change the tyres on my vehicle from run flat tyres to non run flat tyres.

Many Thanks,
Mr Silver Shadow







For peace of mind.. I would email them the tyres you are intending to fit, as I did above, and ensure they make a record of this on your policy including the fact that they have accepted this change.

Hope this helps...

[Baby Dave]

Changing from rfts to non rfts is not a modification to your vehicle and your ins company dont need informing as long as you dont go up a size. Would you inform them if you changed the wipers on your car?or went from non rfts to rfts.

[E90Yaz]

who the fuck declares tyres to insurance?? are u sum kind of numpty???

[Animalfreeride]

Originally Posted by E90Yaz

who the fuck declares tyres to insurance?? are u sum kind of numpty???

Lol. No I'm not a numpty, I'm a cautious numpty. In principal though I agree with you. The issue here is swapping RFT to non-RFT and nothing to do with the make of tyre. Just to clarify my level of numptiness, I wouldn't dream of declaring a change of tyre makes to an insurance company with previous vehicles. Whether you agree or not with the above, the fact is the tyre properties of a RFT are different and the car handles differently. When insurance companies decide on your premium lots of mathematics are applied which are based primarily on statistics. Without trying to insult your intelligence, RFT primary aim are to prevent a catastrophic blow out followed by a loss of control and of course a collision. If a I were to be involved in a collision which resulted in an assessor inspecting my vehicle, I'm fairly sure that this would be something they would look into. As stated, personally I wouldn't want to risk losing £27,000 if they had any opportunity to wriggle out of a claim.

[Silver Shadow]

Originally Posted by E90Yaz

who the fuck declares tyres to insurance?? are u sum kind of numpty???

I don't know if that is directed at me or Animalfreeride... but I think the answer to your articulate question is 'a sensible person' declares tyre changes to their insurance.

Were not talking about changing normal tyre's on a vehicle that is fitted with them from the factory. We are talking about changing the original factory specification from run flats to non run flats. In those circumstances 'you' would be a numpty for not telling your insurance company. If you didnt you may find your insurance policy void.

Its your kind of attitude that makes insurance assessors jobs very easy when refusing claims.... numpty!!!

[willhollin]

What happens if you purchase a second hand 3 series already fitted with non-rfts?

[JLR1969]

Originally Posted by Silver Shadow

I don't know if that is directed at me or Animalfreeride... but I think the answer to your articulate question is 'a sensible person' declares tyre changes to their insurance.

Were not talking about changing normal tyre's on a vehicle that is fitted with them from the factory. We are talking about changing the original factory specification from run flats to non run flats. In those circumstances 'you' would be a numpty for not telling your insurance company. If you didnt you may find your insurance policy void.

Its your kind of attitude that makes insurance assessors jobs very easy when refusing claims.... numpty!!!

+1

Why risk losing your insurance on a £20K+ vehicle, better to be safe than sorry. Numpty

[Silver Shadow]

Originally Posted by willhollin

What happens if you purchase a second hand 3 series already fitted with non-rfts?

Again I would say the onus is on you to inform your insurance company. In my mind it would only be the same as buying a car that had been remapped etc etc.

In my mind it is always best to give the insurance companies absolutely no excuse to refuse a claim. God knows they go through everything with a fine tooth comb when it comes to replacing/repairing your pride and joy.

[Animalfreeride]

Originally Posted by willhollin

What happens if you purchase a second hand 3 series already fitted with non-rfts?

I am aware where something similar happened. In this case the owner, who was totally unaware, purchased a vehicle with larger wheels than the original spec. They were subsequently involved in an accident which resulted in a claim. However this was made null and void owing to above. Unfortunately ignorance holds no defence. I accept we are talking about RFT here but the principal remains the same.

BTW thanks to other forum members for your help. Joking aside I'm not a numpty, I'm reasonably intelligent and hold a good job :-) I thought this forum was all about helping one another. Yes I'm all for a bit of banter and light hearted p*ss taking, but making insulting derogatory remarks doesn't help anyone.

[E90Yaz]

Originally Posted by Baby Dave

Changing from rfts to non rfts is not a modification to your vehicle and your ins company dont need informing as long as you dont go up a size. Would you inform them if you changed the wipers on your car?or went from non rfts to rfts.

+1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THIS IS WOT IM TRYNA SAY! So when u change your wipers from BMW original to ones from your local Kwik Fit or something...dont forget to ring your insurance company

[beemerbird]

Originally Posted by Silver Shadow

In my mind it is always best to give the insurance companies absolutely no excuse to refuse a claim. God knows they go through everything with a fine tooth comb when it comes to replacing/repairing your pride and joy.

Absolutely true!

I know of a claim disputed by an insurance company based on the fact that the tyre pressures on two tyres were incorrect, therefore the handling, braking and stopping distances of the vehicle were compromised and could have contributed to the accident. In other words, they were implying the car was defective at the time of the accident.

Changing from RFT's to non RFT's could be used as a 'get out clause' for an insurance company in the event of a claim as they could argue that non RFT's are not OEM and they were not notified of the change. RFT's are designed to allow the car to be driven in the event of a puncture. Cars with non-RFT's are supplied with either a spare wheel or one of those repair kits. Something else to consider. Common sense to inform them - end of. Think we all know that deep down!!

[pjs]

I'm with the OP. I had that much crap from Privilidge when putting a black grill on previous car, I took it back off within a few days rather than pay an extra £135. They WILL wiggle out of any claim wherever possible. RFT v Non RFT are a modification, wiper blades are simply replacements to the same spec.

[zltm089]

insurance companies/ brokers....together with the stealers....filthy daylight robbery!...

[Silver Shadow]

Originally Posted by E90Yaz

+1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THIS IS WOT IM TRYNA SAY! So when u change your wipers from BMW original to ones from your local Kwik Fit or something...dont forget to ring your insurance company

That would be relevant if we were talking about wipers... but were not. We are talking about changing the original factory tyre specification.. (not brand).

All I can say is good luck if you ever have an insurance assessor examine your car after an accident. Claims are rejected everyday because of attitudes like that... have you read the terms and conditions of your insurance lately??

At the end of the day I have not heard of anyone being charged extra by their insurance company for changing to non-rft's... so whats the problem?

Its just a case of making sure they are aware of the change so they cant shaft you at a later date in the event of a claim.

[lolololol]

I changed from RFT to non RFT and didnt ring the insurance - to be honest it didnt even cross my mind to do so.

[dxb335d]

You guys are worrying me now.

I changed to non runflats yonks ago. I just rung up and told them!? Hope thats ok.

[dxb335d]

Originally Posted by omaragha

I changed from RFT to non RFT and didnt ring the insurance - to be honest it didnt even cross my mind to do so.

Did me,

What if you had a blow out, and went into central reservation, they come out and see a mashed tyre. TYhen look into it and then see that runflats are not ''supposed'' to blow out and that you didnt have runflats on.

Thats why I told them.