[badass335]

This was a post that was sent to me by a buddy in Europe. Its by Enrita and his engine issues. Can some of you sweds out there translate....

http://www.autopower.se/forum/topic....67074&sida=354

Sevak: jag körde med inställningar som Terry gav till mig dag innan. Han sa inte till mig att jag skulle köra med Racegas med detta settings eller att det var en måste. Terry fucked up och gav mig för höga boost inställingar som pajade min bil. Hade han sagt till mig att köra BARA med race gas och meth hade jag inte kört med den mappen hela dagn och då hade jag också hällt in dem 25 ltr. race gas jag hade in bakluckan.
Vi har prövat massor med olika settings och han fick massor med loggar och visste precis hur mycket boost skulle vara.
Jag litade på honom och titta vad har hänt med bilen... han ska vara glad att jag inte förstör honom öffentiligt på alla forum. Han vet väl att han pajade min bil , tror mig.

[yandy]

man google translate has a version, but it isn't nice

[jpsimon]

I don't speak Swedish, can only count in Finnish and say some swears and "the sun is shining"... but that's what google translate is for! very interesting to say the least.


"I drove with settings that Terry gave me the day before. He did not say to me that I would run with Racegas with this settings or that it was a must. Terry fucked up and gave me the high boost any settings that destroyed my car. Had he told me to run ONLY with race gas and meth, I had not run the entire day on that map and then I had also poured into them 25 ltr. race gas I had in the trunk.
We've tried lots of different settings, and he got lots of logs and knew exactly how much would be boosted.
I trusted him and look what happened to the car ... He should be glad I did not destroy him öffentiligt in all forums. He knows well that he pajade my car, believe me."

[BrianMN]

Even though this is an extremely unfortunate situation, I don't think Terry is the one to blame. Nobody is to blame...it's just shit that happens when pushing the limits, albeit costly shit.

In addition, Terry was brought in 2nd hand, with no prior hand in building and tuning this project. Only brought in late into the project and not much info to go off, and no experience with N54s pushing this much power.

Also, common sense should have told Enrita to run race gas, plus wayyy more meth.

[yandy]

Originally Posted by BrianMN

Even though this is an extremely unfortunate situation, I don't think Terry is the one to blame. Nobody is to blame...it's just shit that happens when pushing the limits, albeit costly shit.

In addition, Terry was brought in 2nd hand, with no prior hand in building and tuning this project. Only brought in late into the project and not much info to go off, and no experience with N54s pushing this much power.

Also, common sense should have told Enrita to run race gas, plus wayyy more meth.

+1

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

O man..... Pandora's Box Just opened

[onesuperboi]

I believe Enrita.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by BrianMN

In addition, Terry was brought in 2nd hand, with no prior hand in building and tuning this project. Only brought in late into the project and not much info to go off, and no experience with N54s pushing this much power.

Then he should have acquired the experience before experimenting remotely on a customer car. For instance, in 2009, I flew 3000 miles to Florida to personally learn how hard I could safely push the n54 with my tuning hardware. This was on ASR's 530whp 20psi 135 (who, as a tuning shop, was fully understood the consequences of the job). Likewise, I personally put nitrous on my car (which was against everything I hold dear and holy) before I ever thought about supporting it in the field.

Upgraded turbos and nitrous aren't things to let your customers "test" for you. Even if they are "willing" to do it. How does an uninformed customer quantify just how much risk is involved? And whether it is worth the $10k consequences. While it's convenient for a tuner to be able to place the blame on others (who are following their directions), it's not professional. And it doesn't speak too highly of tuner confidence. I think any other experienced engine tuner on merit would agree with this. While the uninformed fanbois will flame me.

Shiv

[._.]

uh oh !

[forza1976]

Wow, that is quite a revealing post. Interesting stuff if it in fact is true.

[onesuperboi]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Then he should have acquired the experience before experimenting remotely on a customer car. For instance, in 2009, I flew 3000 miles to Florida to personally learn how hard I could safely push the n54 with my tuning hardware. This was on ASR's 530whp 20psi 135 (who, as a tuning shop, was fully understood the consequences of the job). Likewise, I personally put nitrous on my car (which was against everything I hold dear and holy) before I ever thought about supporting it in the field.

Upgraded turbos and nitrous aren't things to let your customers "test" for you. Even if they are "willing" to do it. How does an uninformed customer quantify just how much risk is involved? And whether it is worth the $10k consequences. While it's convenient for a tuner to be able to place the blame on others (who are following their directions), it's not professional. And it doesn't speak too highly of tuner confidence. I think any other experienced engine tuner on merit would agree with this. While the uninformed fanbois will flame me.

Shiv

Perfectly said.

I appreciate the fact that a tuner tests the limits of their cars before running a tune on a customer's car.

And, for that matter, I appreciate learning from everyone who is running a tune and pushing the limits of their car so that the rest of the community can learn from them.

Unfortunately, I don't think it was Enrita's responsibility to see how his car would run on over 20 psi on high speed runs and not just third gear pulls on dynos...

[Ilma]

FWIW one of the reasons I switched from JB is because I felt Terry steered me a certain direction to improve the bottom end torque of my car by bridging the red TPS wires on the wiring harness.

This had the effect of ramping up full boost instead of transitioning it according to throttle position progressively.

He did this because I mentioned that I like the torque kick on my formerly flashed GTI so this was his suggestion to emulate it.

Of course it was only when the tuner codes appeared (this was pre bavarian technic tool) did he admit that they hadn't actually tested this combination.

But he was very interested in how I thought it "felt".

Point being that as good as his customer service is......he is more than happy to let you push things into uncertain territory if you ask.

Of course it's your own fault and you have to assume responsibility for the outcome.....but I can fully understand how enrita feels in this regard.

[badass335]

Originally Posted by onesuperboi

Perfectly said.

I appreciate the fact that a tuner tests the limits of their cars before running a tune on a customer's car.

And, for that matter, I appreciate learning from everyone who is running a tune and pushing the limits of their car so that the rest of the community can learn from them.

Unfortunately, I don't think it was Enrita's responsibility to see how stock turbos run on over 20 psi on high speed runs and not just third gear pulls on dynos...

Just to correct you on this before people jump on this. He had upgraded turbos.

[badass335]

Originally Posted by onesuperboi

I believe Enrita.

+1

[onesuperboi]

Originally Posted by badass335

Just to correct you on this before people jump on this. He had upgraded turbos.

You are correct. My apology. I fixed it.

[M3_WC]

Originally Posted by onesuperboi

I believe Enrita.

Just read emails on other forum. Looks like things read different.

[CBR335]

Come on people, Enrico pushed forward with this project with his own free will, all the while knowing the risks involved with pushing the limits too fast just for the purpose of beating some buddies at the races. Simple and unfortunate. This is never a good way to go about tuning a car. I know this from experience grenading a couple engines in my "youth" without the involvement/intervention of any professional tuner.

This was a one-off project with no previous validation and Terry gave ample warning to take safeguards against engine failure by running race-gas and more meth along with a failsafe. Enrico pushed forward and paid the price.

The same thing could have happened with any tune if you are willing to type in the wrong values into the right fields. I don't think there is a tuner alive that hasn't been implicated in a major failure. I'm sure there will be an immediate disagreement with what I have said by the (ideo)logical.

[CBR335]

Originally Posted by Ilma

Of course it's your own fault and you have to assume responsibility for the outcome....

This is the moral of the story.

[alpinedevil335]

Originally Posted by M3_WC

Just read emails on other forum. Looks like things read different.

Quite different

http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8610

[Slidewayz]

Originally Posted by BrianMN

Even though this is an extremely unfortunate situation, I don't think Terry is the one to blame. Nobody is to blame...it's just shit that happens when pushing the limits, albeit costly shit.

In addition, Terry was brought in 2nd hand, with no prior hand in building and tuning this project. Only brought in late into the project and not much info to go off, and no experience with N54s pushing this much power.

Also, common sense should have told Enrita to run race gas, plus wayyy more meth.

Finding what/whom to blame is paramount. That's called failure analysis and it will stop these things from happening again.

[Cornhusker]

I hardly ever post but after reading terry's comments on the other site I think that his shoot from the hip demeanor when tuning a car with turbos he's never tuned before by email to europe is ridiculous. He never said anything at all when enrita asked for 25psi, except to add race gas, etc.

He could have at least said that he has no idea whether it's safe or not as it's untested but if I was going to test it here's how I would do it......

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by alpinedevil335

Quite different

http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8610

Not sure how different of a story the private emails project.

Also, why are other jb3 users having the same glow ignition/superknock codes that Erita had before his engine failed?

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...=glow+ignition

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...=glow+ignition

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...=glow+ignition

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...=glow+ignition

What can we conclude with this? Do you agree that there could be many more users with the same reoccuring code that don't have the ability to read/confirm the code? Did you notice that none of those user were running "bleeding edge" maps/boost levels.

There's an obvious reason why this is happening specifically to JB tunes. But at the risk of having this discussion go down the drain in flames, I'm not going to say it.

Instead, I just want to know what you think of it? Can all these accounts be attributable to user error, as you suggested is the case with Enrita's engine failure?

A level-headed flame-free response would be appreciated...

Shiv