[the1andonly]

New laws passed today under Obama to double U.S. fuel economy to 54.5 mpg by 2024...the days of the drivers car are coming to a close...

http://money.cnn.com/2012/08/28/auto...P_LN&hpt=hp_t3

[ken1137]

Sure, and I want a computer chip in my contacts to control all my handheld devices. Well, we might get that before this 54 mpg target since technology changes every 6 months. Weren't we suppose to have E85 available for all cars and gas stations ? it's nice to say and write a bill for political reasons but the infrastructure & willingness to change is not in place and Obama will be long gone. That reminds me...why aren't all of the coal power plants meeting President Nixson emissions standards written into a bill in 1972? I digress.

[kensington]

That 54.5 is never set in stone. When auto companies cant meet it im sure the laws will be modified

[135Pats]

All this can be traced back to CAFE law, and the mess it created...Hopefully these targets will never be mandated, we'll see.

[PUREPHAZED]

Great stuff to push the auto makers! I purchased this car because it was one of the best all-round bang for the buck cars for what I needed.

I would purchase the same car again with the Obama numbers by 2024 in a heart beat.

This is another reason the i8 appeals to me.

B,

M

[Zeros and ones]

and all the while Obama is pushing to have such fuel efficient cars we are having delegates proposing this:

http://www.cnn.com/2011/11/18/travel...ion/index.html

The main reason behind this is since we are having more fuel efficient cars, there is not enough tax dollars that covers to keep the roads maintained... (imagine that... think gas is about $4.23 per gallon. not enough money my but )

So they need to make up for the lose by taxing the driver for ever mile driver
So far.. it has been a major disaster in other states that it was implemented in but knowing California and the shit that it actually pulls.... if it has anywhere a chance to pass it is here.

Enjoy the read.

[n54door]

Automakers will continue to forge their ratings while the gov't tries to increase the ratings. It's a stupid game at the expense of tax payers.

Automakes need to find a way to make cars lighter, like the FR-S. If you took the average engine today, and put it in a car that weighed <2k lbs, and put the fat ass american on a diet, the mileage gains would be HUGE!

[Gray_Panther]

Originally Posted by n54door

Automakers will continue to forge their ratings while the gov't tries to increase the ratings. It's a stupid game at the expense of tax payers.

Automakes need to find a way to make cars lighter, like the FR-S. If you took the average engine today, and put it in a car that weighed <2k lbs, and put the fat ass american on a diet, the mileage gains would be HUGE!

Run for president!!

[.b0link]

Dont worry, oil companies will never let this law actually take effect.

[dorkdog]

By 2024 - no oil left?

[Pig Farmer]

With the advent of horizontal shale drilling, the US will be a net exporter of oil by 2024. Unfortunately it is unlikely that we will see a decline in prices. The price of oil is set by World demand.... namely the increased prosperity in China. Hope they set similar MPG standards, but that wishful thinking.

[tranism]

What's wrong with a sports car that gets 54 mpg? I'm down!

[ejm3]

Yeah who says it can't be done?

For much of the 80's-90's & even early 2000's the automakers (especially the US car companies) put their billions in R&D money into developing SUV's and how to make them bigger and more powerful with more options because that's where the profits were. MPG's were fairly low on the average consumer's radar screen. Back in the 90's when the Explorer was the biggest selling vehicle in the country for the US car companies SUV's & pickups made up about 50% of sales but 90% of their profits. So that's where their investment went.

Had they been putting their money into making cars better AND more effecient today we would have cars that get more MPG's.

In 2024 mabye we don't actually average 54 MPG but even if we can average 45 and have decent sports cars thats a win for everybody. Its not out of the realm of possibility if thats where we focus our efforts.

[the1andonly]

to achieve 54 mpg sacrifices will have to be made...i suspect one of them will be drivability

[sluflyer06]

Originally Posted by n54door

Automakers will continue to forge their ratings while the gov't tries to increase the ratings. It's a stupid game at the expense of tax payers.

Automakes need to find a way to make cars lighter, like the FR-S. If you took the average engine today, and put it in a car that weighed <2k lbs, and put the fat ass american on a diet, the mileage gains would be HUGE!

Wat? Forged ratings, what are you smoking? Last time I and many others checked you can get even better mileage than the sticker claims on just about every if not every car....

[n54door]

Originally Posted by sluflyer06

Wat? Forged ratings, what are you smoking? Last time I and many others checked you can get even better mileage than the sticker claims on just about every if not every car....

Open your eyes, many of them do it - Hyundai got caught.

http://www.insideline.com/hyundai/el...pg-claims.html

Bottom line, the MPG rating system is bullshit and can be beaten. It doesn't truly account for a real world test of fuel efficiency. Like weather changes, traffic, uphill/downhill, turns, stop lights, different speed limits, etc... They use a controled close course oval track at a constant speed of 70mph in many of their tests.

[BrokenVert]

And the US also mandated that they'll be 20% wind powered by 2020 - which by the way isn't happening.


Also why does fuel efficiency kill drivability? Last I checked suspension (the fun of ads like the Elise and BRZ) has nothing to do with engines.

Also it's a fleet standard. All that means isthe the companies average for the fleet (ie every car they make in a year) needs to be 54mpg.

It's not every single car they make must be 54mpg - stop being so alarmist. Remember how the 70s and 80s killed the performance car permenatly?


Yeah i dont either...

[tuco44]

Originally Posted by BrokenVert

It's not every single car they make must be 54mpg - stop being so alarmist. Remember how the 70s and 80s killed the performance car permenatly?

+1

[J0E]

Yea just like how the new cars today have managed to triple horsepower and maintain the same mileage as cars from 30 years ago. All that HP gain at no expense to mileage killed the drive-ability of the vehicles today....

I used to be against these laws until I realized that all they seem to be doing is pushing manufacturers to 1. Offer smaller more fuel efficient vehicles in their line up, and 2. make their current vehicles more fuel efficient without affecting performance.

Case in point:

2011 328i sedan: 230hp 200ft-lb 18/28 mpg
2012 328i sedan: 240hp 255ft-lb 23/34 mpg

I have a hard time believing, without a mandate, BMW would have put any time or effort into developing a turbo 4 that could get more horsepower and torque while improving mileage by 6mpg on a bigger car.

[Bill B.]

Originally Posted by J0E

Yea just like how the new cars today have managed to triple horsepower and maintain the same mileage as cars from 30 years ago. All that HP gain at no expense to mileage killed the drive-ability of the vehicles today....

I used to be against these laws until I realized that all they seem to be doing is pushing manufacturers to 1. Offer smaller more fuel efficient vehicles in their line up, and 2. make their current vehicles more fuel efficient without affecting performance.

Case in point:

2011 328i sedan: 230hp 200ft-lb 18/28 mpg
2012 328i sedan: 240hp 255ft-lb 23/34 mpg

I have a hard time believing, without a mandate, BMW would have put any time or effort into developing a turbo 4 that could get more horsepower and torque while improving mileage by 6mpg on a bigger car.

They probably wouldn't even need to introduce smaller and smaller models to their fleet if they didn't keep increasing the bloat for the models they do have. Imagine the gains in fuel efficiency if they actually kept the model the same size.

[ejm3]

Remember the 5.0 liter Mustangs from the late 80's that churned out a whopping 200 or so HP.

Now they have a 600 HP Mustang that probably gets about the same mileage and is superior in every way. Imagine what they could have done if they were actually *trying* (or even forced) to improve gas mileage.

Improved mileage doesn't ruin drivability or fun and recent history has proven it. If customers demand it manufacturers will be forced to deliver.

And as noted its an average and not every car will have to get 54 MPG. And there's no saying that in 2019 they won't change it to 50 or 45 MPG because its just more realistic. If you set the target at 35 the automakers will say they can only do 31. Set the target high and negotiate from there as we get closer to the date.

[Tom K.]

Originally Posted by the1andonly

...the days of the drivers car are coming to a close...

And years ago, folks claimed there haven't been real "drivers' cars" since they added electric start and moved the steering wheel to the left side back around 1912!

Tom