[DWR]

Don't know how you get the DDE to work if you don't give it a minimal amount of info from the trans. Things are pretty integrated today. Info is over the CANBUS. Don't understand how to do that with a Tremec. Not saying you can't, just haven't seen it done. Does anyone know what info is transmitted by a manual trans in a BMW? Certainly speed and I'd guess gear selection.

[335duff]

I'm not sure. I'm under the impression that when manuals are swapped on gasser 335s or on the e46 m3 or whatever, that the dde is reflashed to be essentially identical to one from a manual transmission car. I don't know if anyone has modified A/T software to deal with a manual. I imagine the errors could be coded out somehow though, but naturally I don't know anything about it.

[DWR]

Originally Posted by 335duff

I'm not sure. I'm under the impression that when manuals are swapped on gasser 335s or on the e46 m3 or whatever, that the dde is reflashed to be essentially identical to one from a manual transmission car. I don't know if anyone has modified A/T software to deal with a manual. I imagine the errors could be coded out somehow though, but naturally I don't know anything about it.

That's my understanding too, but in the cases I know of they were BMW transmissions. Then the connectors and signals match.

[mefferso]

Originally Posted by iaknown

The idea of that 8 speed auto sounds great but do you have solid proof it was ever offered with the M57? I see lots of talk about it but no actual models coming here with it.

And then coding is another story but if it was offered with the M57 that may be a start.

Did some looking and I think you're correct. Appears N57 got the 8 speed and M57 was 6 speed only.

[Hoooper]

It shouldn't NEED any information if you can code it out. Speed usually comes from ABS readings. Gear indicator doesn't really matter unless you plan to use gear based torque reduction. Other than that you could have a neutral safety switch which would have to be wired to operate like the p/n switch anyway and could just be on the clutch pedal instead.

[DWR]

Originally Posted by Hoooper

It shouldn't NEED any information if you can code it out.

Well, yes of course. That may be trivial. Someone has to figure it out was my point.

Originally Posted by Hoooper

Speed usually comes from ABS readings.

Good point.

[UnhuZ]

Hi,

here in Europe, the F series 35d (535d, 335d, etc) come with a 8 speed...

xDrive on the F30 but RWD on the F10.

I think that should be a bolt-on hardware-wise, but the electronic interaction of this 8 speed with the rest of our E9X is what mess this all up.

Nuno

[Jim1985]

That would be my ideal car. My 335d with the 8 speed twin clutch box out of the F series (like the 330d I've been driving)

[iaknown]

That'd be aweseome but unfortunately the chances of that happening are slim to none.

Much worse than coding out errors and faults from dropping in a manual would be to try to have our dde talk to a newer auto. I'll still be happy if I can get a manual to work, still in the process of researching things....

[Jim1985]

So there's zero chance of the 8 speed talking to our cars? That makes me a sad panda. I've been looking at boxes all afternoon! £1200 will get me one!

[iaknown]

Originally Posted by Jim1985

So there's zero chance of the 8 speed talking to our cars? That makes me a sad panda. I've been looking at boxes all afternoon! £1200 will get me one!

Ha, well here's the thing.....the 8HP70 has the most torque capacity and is rated at 516ft lb. That kind of defeats the purpose of this endeavor. We would have better programming (if the huge challenge of making it compatible was overcome) but still not a stronger trans. Not worth the effort in my opinion.

[Hoooper]

FYI Jim the 8 speed is a traditional slushbox, not a twin clutch. The twin clutch box offered by BMW is a 7 speed for the time being.

[Whitbread]

Originally Posted by iaknown

That'd be aweseome but unfortunately the chances of that happening are slim to none.

Much worse than coding out errors and faults from dropping in a manual would be to try to have our dde talk to a newer auto. I'll still be happy if I can get a manual to work, still in the process of researching things....

Looking at the ratios of the tremec, you'd actually have to swap to an m3 rear diff to end up in the same ballpark at highway speed. Did M3's get a factory lsd by chance?

On the other hand, if you're building a land speed car the .5:1 6th gear with the 335D rear end would get to 265mph at 4800rpm

[iaknown]

Originally Posted by Whitbread

Looking at the ratios of the tremec, you'd actually have to swap to an m3 rear diff to end up in the same ballpark at highway speed. Did M3's get a factory lsd by chance?

On the other hand, if you're building a land speed car the .5:1 6th gear with the 335D rear end would get to 265mph at 4800rpm

Not sure where you're looking but there are several TR6060's with a .63 6th gear. That'd be ideal with our diff.

[Jim1985]

Originally Posted by Hoooper

FYI Jim the 8 speed is a traditional slushbox, not a twin clutch. The twin clutch box offered by BMW is a 7 speed for the time being.

Everyday's a school day
In that case I'm not sure what gearbox was in the 330d I was driving, but it was amazing.

Originally Posted by iaknown

Not sure where you're looking but there are several TR6060's with a .63 6th gear. That'd be ideal with our diff.

That made me laugh

Originally Posted by iaknown

Ha, well here's the thing.....the 8HP70 has the most torque capacity and is rated at 516ft lb. That kind of defeats the purpose of this endeavor. We would have better programming (if the huge challenge of making it compatible was overcome) but still not a stronger trans. Not worth the effort in my opinion.

Torque capacity I'm not overly bothered about, I'll take that with a pinch of salt so to speak. It's more the drivability I'm interested in, I.e. Torque converter lockup!

Originally Posted by Whitbread

Looking at the ratios of the tremec, you'd actually have to swap to an m3 rear diff to end up in the same ballpark at highway speed. Did M3's get a factory lsd by chance?

See I'm not an expert on gearing, but I know the fears are different on petrol vs diesel cars. But would changing the WHOLE driveline counter these differences? 335d engine -> M3 box -> M3 diff & axle etc
Would that bring the ratios back into diesel territory? If it does, then perhaps DCT is what I want...
I'm confused.

[Whitbread]

Originally Posted by iaknown

Not sure where you're looking but there are several TR6060's with a .63 6th gear. That'd be ideal with our diff.

I know of the .63 6th option, it would drop 200rpm off our current 6th gear. As long as the motor is happy and egt's stay in check, it should be fine.

I should've clarified, when I was speaking earlier the fingers were ahead of the brain slightly. I was talking in reference to swapping in an m3 rear pumpkin if they came with a factory lsd and running the .5:1 6th ratio trans. Should help get the car out of the hole even harder and maybe get an lsd cheaper than doing a wavetrac install. Just some tech food for thought.

[iaknown]

Originally Posted by Whitbread

I know of the .63 6th option, it would drop 200rpm off our current 6th gear. As long as the motor is happy and egt's stay in check, it should be fine.

I should've clarified, when I was speaking earlier the fingers were ahead of the brain slightly. I was talking in reference to swapping in an m3 rear pumpkin if they came with a factory lsd and running the .5:1 6th ratio trans. Should help get the car out of the hole even harder and maybe get an lsd cheaper than doing a wavetrac install. Just some tech food for thought.

Ahh I see. This may be a good idea for someone else.....I already have a MFactory so it wouldn't benefit me.

[BB_cuda]

Originally Posted by iaknown

Ahh I see. This may be a good idea for someone else.....I already have a MFactory so it wouldn't benefit me.

Iaknown, I recall you asking us which way to go on the Mfactory, 2.83:1 or a numerically lower (was it 2.6:1?). which way did you go?

[iaknown]

Originally Posted by BB_cuda

Iaknown, I recall you asking us which way to go on the Mfactory, 2.83:1 or a numerically lower (was it 2.6:1?). which way did you go?

The DCT diff is 2.56 if I remember but I stayed with the stock 2.81 ratio

[BB_cuda]

I thought i would give this thread a kick in the pants. Iaknown, did you get any traction on this?

[torqueisking]

Originally Posted by DWR

Don't know how you get the DDE to work if you don't give it a minimal amount of info from the trans. Things are pretty integrated today. Info is over the CANBUS. Don't understand how to do that with a Tremec. Not saying you can't, just haven't seen it done. Does anyone know what info is transmitted by a manual trans in a BMW? Certainly speed and I'd guess gear selection.

Not sure it can be done but I'd try to mimic the slushbox with an arduino + CAN bus shield or use the AT ECU and send data to it.

[Tiago]

I'm tracking a gearbox solution for years.

Manual gearbox: we can find manual gearboxes in other versions of the m57 that is a direct fit for our cars, like x25d (3.0d) and x30d. There isn't any manual x35d, in US or Europe. The conversion is quite simple as you just need to delete the auto gearbox from ecu. The clutch pedals and all other things is a plug and play retrofit from the manual m57 cars. There is also several solutions to reinforce the manual clutch to handle insane torque levels. The only issue is the lower top end speed because stock gearbox is able to +200mph and with manual m57 it will be reduced to 160mph. There is 35d engine swaps for others car brands with huge sucess. One of them is on 4x4 Nissan Patrol with a special plate adapter for his Y61 gearbox.

Auto gearbox: you can't use the newer bmw gearboxes because you have to marry the gearbox software with car ecu software and this is just not possible. The only option is to make a special adapter plate for a aftermarket auto gearbox with independent software and hardware controllers and erase that function from car ecu like if with a manual gearbox. The other option is to send our gearboxes to australia because they are used to reinforce this gearboxes with 6r80 parts and others special parts on their 7sec cars with +1000rwhp and +1000rwtq Ford Falcons which share the ZF 6hp26. They also cracked the software and are able to tune their gearboxes. But the bmw software is at other level and is still a mystery for the common world. This solution without the software tune is the best but be prepared for +$20k.