[BMOEW]

But their end tanks... Lol
Whoo gives a fuckkkk if u don't like there fmic just pick another one u like we all have opinions in this world and u both don't need to be going at it

[BMOEW]

Btw I called ur shop and you guys are not answering thanks

[timtech]

Originally Posted by Clap135

http://www.dvdtfab.com/intercoolertestlab.pdf

I don't have a horse in the race but you do know you are quoting a paper from a first / second year college mechanical engineer?

http://www.linkedin.com/pub/albert-raczynski/10/7b6/748
>albert raczynski’s Education

* University of Illinois at Chicago
BS , Mechanical Engineering , 2002 — 2006


DVDTFAB › tech articles
tech articles

Write up of some testing on intercooler end tank design, done back in 2003:

I would really like to see some other intercoolers put Helix to the test - since I'm in the market. Personally for me, just about anything outside of stock would net what I'm looking for - and one of the big choices is close to home for me - but third party tests are always good to learn from.

[TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management]

Now I understand what you are saying, the stepped core is unique and as a scientist you know every design is a compromise between space and utilization, in order to utilize the thinner top section we had to compromise by going straight up, the 90 degree turn you talk about. BUT given the space and the objects we dodged (the radiator above it and the bumper in front of it) this captive area dictated this shape(how would you have handled the endtank shape in this area knowing we utilize all available space in our design?) you call this a negative but by utilizing the stepped section we got alot of positive attributes: we picked up 5 more charge rows, we increased frontal exposed ambient face by 56% the extra charge rows allowed us to use a denser fin count and increased the mass of the unit. Our revised endtanks are completely round and we chose to utilize a bellmouth on the inside of the casting for the inlet and outlet tubes, it was never a tube into a wall as you are trying to state!
I wholeheartedly DO NOT agree that pressure drop is the most important aspect of intercooling if it was why use an intercooler at all??? replace the damn thing with a 2.5" tube and call it a day. intercooling is a compromise and balance of AIT drop-Heatsoak resistance and pressure drop. Shiv did the pressure drop testing vs a few other intercoolers I will see if I can get that data BUT the Helix had the lowest pressure drop of the bunch on the same car and same boost levels.

heres a pic of my car the fmic goes all the way up to the top of the bumper inlet utilizing all of the avilable opening in the front of the car:




lastly I have been answering your questions can you please answer the questions I asked of you? -You have already stated rounded endtanks are better than square ones, I agree as well.

-Do you agree rounded(tube and fin style) bars are better for airflow through the ambient side of the core than the flat bars on a bar and plate intercooler?

-Do you agree rounded bars are better for airflow direction and pressure drop through the charge side of the core than the flat bars on a bar and plate intercooler?

-Do you agree that a taller thinner intercooler fully exposed to ambient air is better for temp reduction and resistance to heat soak than a shorter thicker intercooler of the same volume?

-Do You agree that a 2.25" ID outlet tube is superior to utilizing the factory connectors that shrink down to 1.75"ID at the entrance of the factory O-ring connections?

-Do you think that adding size in an area of more direct airflow is superior to adding size to an intercooler below the BMW factory plastic cowl(not in direct airflow) ?

-Do you think that you can utilize a better core in regards to internal and external fin counts through testing vs using an off the shelf core simply because it fits?


most of the answers are in this intercooling FAQ
http://www.are.com.au/feat/techtalk/intecoolersMR.htm

Originally Posted by Clap135

I am not wasting anyone's time but yours. Your intercooler goes against the law of physics according to you. Ill post this again incase you missed it.

Theory? Realise you are talking to someone who deals with physics on a daily basis. It pays the bills.

http://www.dvdtfab.com/intercoolertestlab.pdf


BTW all your questions are cute, here is one that will put all those to shame.
Do you realize that the biggest restriction in airflow comes from endtanks, not the core?

Your stepped car might spark intrest. You state it gets airflow, Do you have a picture showing your IC installed with the bumper on?
LIke state before, ait are only a part of equation, pressure drop/flow imo is the bigger factor. Please post data showing these pressure drop/flow tests?

[TurboBullett@Ambient Thermal Management]

Originally Posted by BMOEW

Btw I called ur shop and you guys are not answering thanks

sorry we were all busy prepping 100 Mini and BMW Intercoolers for shipping!

[Clap135]

lmao...yea busy.
You asked me question as if im selling something here. I asked questions about the helix and they didnt get answered. You make these things but have shiv test the pressure drop? What kind of RD is that?

[Clap135]

Originally Posted by timtech

I don't have a horse in the race but you do know you are quoting a paper from a first / second year college mechanical engineer?

http://www.linkedin.com/pub/albert-raczynski/10/7b6/748
>albert raczynski’s Education

* University of Illinois at Chicago
BS , Mechanical Engineering , 2002 — 2006


DVDTFAB › tech articles
tech articles

Write up of some testing on intercooler end tank design, done back in 2003:

I would really like to see some other intercoolers put Helix to the test - since I'm in the market. Personally for me, just about anything outside of stock would net what I'm looking for - and one of the big choices is close to home for me - but third party tests are always good to learn from.

Whats your point? You need to actually go into one of these shops and see what RD really is lol. Very few companies actually do RD outside of making sure the thing fits. Claims like we are the best, this is the best, we tested others ect are what start these discussion. I simply call bullshit, and there no data to proove me other wise so get what you want, but keep in mind I am not pushing parts here and could really careless if helix sells something or if some other brand sells something. Now if i had a horse in this race, Id be more inclined to go through this testing, but like stated, I simply don't care.

[timtech]

Originally Posted by Clap135

Whats your point? You need to actually go into one of these shops and see what RD really is lol.

I have gone into the local shop here and I seen their R&D and it was quite impressive. Now how it stands up to the others I don't know because every one knows you can skew data/tests a million ways to make your product come out on top.

I used to be a fan of Corky Bell - but even his work is looking outdated - and he has been doing this for a long time.

I like what you posted about the end tanks. That makes sense to me. This blog fills in the other areas:
http://takemebeyondthehorizon.wordpr...ler-selection/

I have an idea of what I would like to see in a product but if I can get something off a shelf that is 90% of the way to my wish list, I think I'm doing very well.

[David1]

Who still makes an FMIC the uses stock connectors?

[chiaobaby]

Originally Posted by David1

Who still makes an FMIC the uses stock connectors?

RPI

HPF

VK

[David1]

Originally Posted by chiaobaby

RPI

HPF

VK

Thanks!

[WWM3]

Anyone have experience with install/uninstall. Easiest? Toughest? Thanks!

[chiaobaby]

Originally Posted by WW330

Anyone have experience with install/uninstall. Easiest? Toughest? Thanks!

HPF

VK

[wazup773]

ams!!!!!!!!!!

[Rockstarr]

Here is a thread that you may be interested in . I went with Helix and the instal was quite easy with no trimming.

FMIC Comparison Thread

[Kongen71]

Originally Posted by Mike@N54Tuning.com

LOL

I was going to post but then saw this so thought twice, but just want to offer advice

I have sold/carry many brands but I would say the two I like the most and my customers like the most are the AMS and Helix. Both are great units and fitment is spot on!

Mike

Which units fit without modding the bumper etc. (I have an 335i without m-kit). How easy is it to install? Need special tools?

[ar design]

The Forge FMIC requires 0 trimming, and has great fitment!

[ETS Michael]

Originally Posted by Kongen71

Which units fit without modding the bumper etc. (I have an 335i without m-kit). How easy is it to install? Need special tools?

ETS

[joneffingvo]

Evolution Racewerks!!!

[forza1976]

Originally Posted by ar design

The Forge FMIC requires 0 trimming, and has great fitment!

+1

[Tiago@VRSF]

Originally Posted by Clap135

Helix has by far the worse endtanks I have ever seen. Simply apply common sense when looking at the desgin of that intercooler......People who spend money on something will always tell you their brand is the best.



Seriously? Would you rather have airflow going through bends or 90 degree angles? Whats up with the outlet/inlet pipes simple welded to the center of a block? Its simply horrible and yet people who don't know any better believe marketing bs and say omg its the bestest eva! Think.

Incase you lack common sense, here are some facts
http://www.dvdtfab.com/intercoolertestlab.pdf

+1

I've been saying this forever but apparently the more popular choice is the best choice when there's so much ignorance around.

[Tiago@VRSF]

Originally Posted by TTurboBullett

heres a pic of my car the fmic goes all the way up to the top of the bumper inlet utilizing all of the avilable opening in the front of the car:

I must be blind, I only see about 4" of usable surface area in that picture shown. You have a lot of unused surface area using that bumper with the Helix. You'd have to be blind or dumb not to understand that.