[Sniz]

Originally Posted by themyst

Well, 60-130 can be manipulated by slope though. If comparison 60-130 results are done on a 0 slope, sure I would agree with you, but how often do we see that?

yes, but there is simply no way you can argue that a 1/4 mile run is a better indicator of power than 60-130 if monitored correctly.

[themyst]

Originally Posted by Sniz

yes, but there is simply no way you can argue that a 1/4 mile run is a better indicator of power than 60-130 if monitored correctly.

Right, like I said, if the 60-130 comparisons are done on a 0 slope it's a great barometer of power output. But if one guy does a 9.5 on a 0 slope, and another guy does 8.4 on a 2.8% slope, how can we compare? That was my point really.

[jpsimon]

Originally Posted by themyst

Well, 60-130 can be manipulated by slope though. If comparison 60-130 results are done on a 0 slope, sure I would agree with you, but how often do we see that?

I assume IL does their 1/4 testing on the same "track". So if they were to do 60-130 testing (which they don't and we're talking totally hypothetically) then I would assume they would use the same 60-130 "track" every time to keep it consistent.

either way there are far less variables. With 60-130 at least you can see exactly what that slope is vs. all the random variables (driver skill, traction issues, etc) with 1/4 comparisons.

[aflatau]

Does any one know, if shiv wants to chime in too that would be great.. if they are running the stock fuel pump? stock rear end? lsd? stock tranny? stock axels?

[The Ghost]

Originally Posted by aflatau

Does any one know, if shiv wants to chime in too that would be great.. if they are running the stock fuel pump? stock rear end? lsd? stock tranny? stock axels?

There are about 8 threads on this, but LSD, 3.46 rear, upgrades axles, a fuel mod which they are keeping to themselves for the time being. Stock tranny.

[Redbmwm33]

Very modest results. I am sure with time this single turbo will have promising results.

[aflatau]

Originally Posted by The Ghost

There are about 8 threads on this, but LSD, 3.46 rear, upgrades axles, a fuel mod which they are keeping to themselves for the time being. Stock tranny.

thank you.

[jippii ensio]

Originally Posted by Sniz

yes, but there is simply no way you can argue that a 1/4 mile run is a better indicator of power than 60-130 if monitored correctly.

Why are you interested in power?

Personally, I'm interested in quick acceleration rather than power as the main objective. Also, I'm interested in all the numbers, 60-130 as well as 1/4. If you are interested just in power, go and dyno your car. If you are interested in quick acceleration, power does not give you a full and correct picture. As an example, traction is a major factor that should not be forgotten if anyone is interested in acceleration. 60-130 is one measure of acceleration and as such rather interesting for me along with 1/4. However, I'm not interested in it for trying to derive power out of it.

Power is nothing without control. You should be interested in traction.

[Laguna Seca Blue]

I'm not a nuclear scientist or anything, but I'm fairly certain there is one very good reason car magazines don't do 60-130mph runs...

Most cars just can't get to 130 miles per hour. Either they just don't have enough grunt, or they have electronic speed limiters.

Imagine how that would look in a comparison test:
60-130 times.
2007 BMW 335i: 10 seconds
2007 Toyota Corolla: 23 hours and counting...

Obviously, they would never compare these two cars, but I think my point is made

[Sniz]

Originally Posted by jippii ensio

Why are you interested in power?

Personally, I'm interested in quick acceleration rather than power as the main objective. Also, I'm interested in all the numbers, 60-130 as well as 1/4. If you are interested just in power, go and dyno your car. If you are interested in quick acceleration, power does not give you a full and correct picture. As an example, traction is a major factor that should not be forgotten if anyone is interested in acceleration. 60-130 is one measure of acceleration and as such rather interesting for me along with 1/4. However, I'm not interested in it for trying to derive power out of it.

Power is nothing without control. You should be interested in traction.

ok, traction has a ton more to do with your suspension and tire setup as well as the driver than anything. yes that is massively important as well.

we are not discussing Shiv's suspension setup, or maybe we are?

[Proper Motion LLC]

Originally Posted by Sleeper

- copy/paste... "They might need to hire someone new to weld the headers. Those collectors and flanges look like something I did back in University when I welded our team's exhaust together (after 1/2 an hour of TIG welding training). Pretty ghetto."


I'm not sure how much I'd trust the transfer case to last more than one launch....

AR Design or HPF Prolly posted that lol

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by jippii ensio

Why are you interested in power?

Personally, I'm interested in quick acceleration rather than power as the main objective. Also, I'm interested in all the numbers, 60-130 as well as 1/4. If you are interested just in power, go and dyno your car. If you are interested in quick acceleration, power does not give you a full and correct picture. As an example, traction is a major factor that should not be forgotten if anyone is interested in acceleration. 60-130 is one measure of acceleration and as such rather interesting for me along with 1/4. However, I'm not interested in it for trying to derive power out of it.

Power is nothing without control. You should be interested in traction.

This car has an Achilles heal with traction.

Independent suspension, and not enough tire out back (width wise).

You ever see what size tire a Mustang has with a solid rear axle making nearly 650WHP with good traction, we arent even close

Hell even a stock Vette comes with larger tires stock then we can fit on aftermarket.

It will be interesting to see what suspension tweaks have done to the improvement of overall traction, there is always room for improvement but you can only go so far with limited tire and a suspension setup (stock) not intended for straight line traction.

This might not be the perfect platform for this power, but I'm sure its fun eitherway.

[blackshan]

Nicely said Jeff!

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by Jeff@topgearsolutions

This car has an Achilles heal with traction.

Independent suspension, and not enough tire out back (width wise).

You ever see what size tire a Mustang has with a solid rear axle making nearly 650WHP with good traction, we arent even close

Hell even a stock Vette comes with larger tires stock then we can fit on aftermarket.

It will be interesting to see what suspension tweaks have done to the improvement of overall traction, there is always room for improvement but you can only go so far with limited tire and a suspension setup (stock) not intended for straight line traction.

This might not be the perfect platform for this power, but I'm sure its fun eitherway.

With 650whp, I think we will always be traction limited up to (and sometimes in) 3rd gear. That's just a fact of life with a mega powered RWD car. This can be mostly resolved by driving on Pilot Sport Cup (semi-R compound street tire) or drag radials assuming a good suspension. But what's the point? Crazies like me think wheelspin is fun since it makes you actually drive the car. Unless you have enough power on tap to spin the tires on the straights between corners, you're just steering the car, not driving it. Some of the most rewarding skills to learn when running a big power rwd car is being able to control power with your right foot, not by giving the car unlimited mechanical grip.

That's my idea of power with control. It comes from the nut behind the steering wheel. Not from stuff you can buy in catalog. The stuff you buy can just make the DRIVER'S job a little easier by reducing unwanted suspension movement, retaining tire contact patch better and by damping the spring properly.

[themyst]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

With 650whp, I think we will always be traction limited up to (and sometimes in) 3rd gear. That's just a fact of life with a mega powered RWD car. This can be mostly resolved by driving on Pilot Sport Cup (semi-R compound street tire) or drag radials assuming a good suspension. But what's the point? Crazies like me think wheelspin is fun since it makes you actually drive the car. Unless you have enough power on tap to spin the tires on the straights between corners, you're just steering the car, not driving it. Some of the most rewarding skills to learn when running a big power rwd car is being able to control power with your right foot, not by giving the car unlimited mechanical grip.

That's my idea of power with control. It comes from the nut behind the steering wheel. Not from stuff you can buy in catalog. The stuff you buy can just make the DRIVER'S job a little easier by reducing unwanted suspension movement, retaining tire contact patch better and by damping the spring properly.

As a former 6MT N54 owner I say, to each their own.